332 thoughts on “We better win this series game thread: Aug 10, Braves at Astros”

  1. From Previous thread: (and yes I should include Longoria and Braun)

    All things considered (contract situation etc.) here is a list of the players I would consider for Teheran at this point:

    Joey Votto
    Josh Hamilton
    Carlos Gonzalez
    Andre Ethier
    Matt Kemp
    Colby Rasmus
    Stephen Strasburg
    Edit: Justin Upton (added though I’m not as high on him as most)

    That’s the list (I may be overlooking a guy or two)

    To suggest we should give up Teheran for a past his prime pitcher with a market-neutral contract is sheer lunacy.

  2. Typing away merrily on a dead thread …

    PWHjort, in response to your thoughts:

    @126 – Uproven means that the prospect has never pitched against ML hitting talent and, especially for starters, the number of innings/appearances that ML starters are required to make. Uproven also includes the element of uncertainty that you describe, but ML players have proven that they can take the increased stress and workload. A lot of injuries happen when players in the minors have to increase the number of pitches they throw in a game and season and when they start trying to learn new pitches.

    Unproven also means that they have not yet shown the ability to adjust to ML quality hitters during an at bat and through the season (what I’ve often seen referred to as “pitching” v. “throwing”). These are not skills that most pitchers have to master until the high minors.

    Unproven also includes an element of maturity and judgment that, let’s face it, a lot of very young players do not have.

  3. I spent a good portion of my childhood in Houston. I went to a ton of Astro games in the Dome.

    There is a lot of cool NASA stuff to do. It is not too far from Galviston.A huge medical industry. Univiersity of Houston and Rice are there. Of course, it is an oil town.

    The city is named for former Tennessee Governor and Texas president, Sam Houston.

    Famous Houstonians include:

    Clint Black, Shelly Duvall, Farrah Fawcett,Clark Gable, Lyle Lovett,
    Dennis and Randy Quaid, Phylicia Rashad, Anne Rice, Jacyln Smith, Danielle Steele, Patrick Swayze,Renee Zellweger.

  4. Houston also appears to have a disproportionate share of adult-oriented commercial enterprises. Or maybe it’s just that they often pop up in the middle of established neighborhoods that makes them appear so numerous.

  5. The only interesting observation I could come up with is that Houston is the fourth-largest city in the country, but if you tell people that they won’t believe you.

  6. My cousin was a bat boy/clubhouse attendant for the Astros for a long time. Mike Scott liked to throw him in the hot tub repeatedly. And he wasn’t a good tipper.

  7. Frankly, Houston reminds me a lot of Atlanta–both Sunbelt cities with lots of tall corporate buildings and endless miles of highway and unendurable traffic. Of course, I have been in Houston a lot more recently than Atlanta.

    When the Braves were really bad in the 70s and 80s, they were often pretty decent at home and could be a difficult team for a contender coming in. That’s how I see the Astros.

  8. Only been to Houston twice.

    For some reason, I’ll always recall my first trip from the airport to the hotel—the interstate was full of Hummers. Must’ve seen a dozen of them. (I know, that’s so-o-o 2003.)

  9. I think the concept of “major league hitters” is a little overblown. Just because a hitter is in the major leagues doesn’t mean that they are necessarily better than someone in the minor leagues. Certainly there’s a higher concentration of “good hitters” to “bad hitters” in the majors, but it’s not like people who come up to the majors are suddenly worlds away better than everyone in the minors. There’s plenty of overlap.

    See: Nate McLouth, Jeff Francoeur, Yunie Betancourt, etc.

    All this to say that I think the notion of “proven” vs. “unproven” is a little archaic.

    In before Jeff K is insulted by this post.

  10. Only been to Houston once when my brother had a tournament there. Got to catch a game at the Astrodome against the Indians. Last time I got to watch David Justice in person.

  11. @10, bat boys do expect to get tips. It’s been the tradition in pro sports since their inception – there are plenty of references to it from the dawn of baseball. In fact, (can’t remember who said it now) but at one point pro baseballers got $200 per game. A player was tipping the clubhouse attendant the standard $10, and realized that with a 25 man roster, he was making more than the players.

  12. Houston is an ugly city. Everything looks old and outdated.

    Also, lots and lots of fat people.

  13. I moved to Houston about a year ago,and I must say, it’s a much better town than I thought it would be. Except for the weather, of course.

    I was at last night’s game, which was a lot of fun, until it suddenly wasn’t. But hey, it wasn’t as bad as a game I saw at Shea once, when the Braves were leading 8-0 and collapsed, losing 10-8. (I also go to games where the Braves don’t fall apart, BTW).

  14. @10 – My cousin (the bat boy) got great tips from every player on the team but Mike Scott. As a matter of fact, he would come home several thousand dollars richer after the last home game of every season.

    Not sure if this is standard though. I assume it is.

  15. Really like Houstonians – every one of them I’ve met has been good, solid folk.

    Not crazy about the weather and the Urban Policy student in me wrestles with the laissez faire zoning laws.

    Love the freedom – not always crazy about the results (e.g., porn shops next to churches – marketplace of ideas, I guess …)

  16. 3,
    I’m willing to concede the point about workload, though I don’t think doing it once or twice proves anything. Ben Sheets has managed to put together 4 30+ start seasons. Still, I do agree that doing it once is a big step.

    I just think the whole proven/unproven thing is 1) misused a lot and 2) overblown even when it isn’t. If the MLB organizations are putting half as much effort into evaluation as they would have us believe, it shouldn’t be nearly as big of an issue.

  17. I’ve been in Houston for about eight years and much like ralphdibny I think it’s not such a bad place. The city has most of the perks you’d expect from a major metropolitan area but it’s very affordable and livable.

    Unfortunately, it’s not tourist friendly.

    You definitely want to experience Houston with a local because most of the places worth seeing, dining or grabbing a cold one are tucked away in neighborhoods.

    Ralph, what part or town are you in? I’m in Oak Forest.

  18. No, can’t believe Mac, you didn’t write the city about Houston. :) My personal opinion though, don’t prefer hot weather areas.
    Are there lots of fat people in Houston? It can’t be! Lots of fat people all over America. Just remember that America is the most fat people in the world according to the research Hahahahahaha.

    With regard to the previous game,
    Bobby Cox said “We gave up a ton of bloopers in the seventh inning that hurt,”
    By watching the video, Glaus’fault was the most disappointing one. It was grossly negligence in my opinion. The veteran didn’t set a good example to rookie.

  19. Lineup:

    Infante 2b / Heyward rf / Jones 3b
    Diaz lf / McCann c / Cadaver 1b
    AGony ss / Ankiel “cf” / Jurrjens p, pb

    pb = ‘poor bastard’

  20. @ 14, 17 – Live and learn. I can imagine many worse ways to earn a few extra dollars.

    @21 – Totally agree it can be overblown, but it’s not overblown I think to weigh in a player’s projected value the risk that they do not live up to expectations. Organizations do it all the time — baseball and others. In the insurance industry it’s underwriting, actuarial sciences, and amortization.

    @12 – Troll.

  21. Really???? Everyone has not been kind Troy Glaus in two months? Ahem, I am very kind Mr. Remington!

  22. Heyward out of his AA meeting in time to play some baseball. Today in the 12 steps he apologized profusely to his teammates for calling Glaus a no-good lump of elephant waste

  23. Dirt,

    I’m just south of you, in Shepherd Forest.

    Off to the game! They can’t disappoint me two days in a row, right? :)

  24. Heyward thing on E60 right now.
    Wow, he had a good 5 inches on everyone on that team.

  25. Mondesi hasn’t retired? I thought he was the mayor of some town in the DR.

    EDIT: Oh, NOW I get it.

  26. I’ve been listening to a lot of circus music, yakety sax, and things of the sort to prepare for the game…

    And wow, I bet if I say “Entry of The Gladiatiors” by Julius Fucik you have no idea what I’m talking about… but you have ALL heard it, trust me

  27. That 5 AM Grand Slam breakfast at Denny’s isn’t sitting too well in his stomach. I blame Melky.

  28. Heyward was scratched from the lineup. Odds on “flulike symptoms”?

    Geez, he’s still hung over? Get him some hair of the dog!

    (It’s fun to turn 21. Even in Houston.)

  29. New lienup- AGony now bats second, and Melkworth now plays right and bats seventh. I don’t blame Heyward, though; last night’s game could drive anyone to drink.

  30. @33 – Yeah, I realized about 10 seconds too late that Caminiti is dead and a few others, though still involved in baseball, are no longer players. That post was a good candidate for the “request deletion” option.

    EDIT: I note, happily, that Chipper is not on your list. Glavine probably should have been.

  31. Kotsay wasn’t THAT bad with the Braves. Surely there’s another CF that should have retired moreso than Kotsay.

  32. According to Ron Gant, Michael Bourn is “always one of the league leaders in on-base percentage.”

    Michael Bourn has a career OBP of .328.

  33. ‘Feel the glove’ – somebody just push him out of the window of the pressbox. No jury would convict.

  34. Can’t do it on the road, Robert. Not unless the defense attorney is allowed to play a few minutes of Chip’s greatest hits.

  35. I’m fortunate enough not to have to listen to the guy, but is Chip actually getting dumber this year?

  36. Well Guilley’s has been out of business for a long time, so we know Heyward did hurt it there.

    (Urban Cowboy reference of the season)

  37. Why is Francoeur not just thankful that he has a big league job with the way he’s played? Dumb ass.

  38. In a telephone interview, Fletcher indicated she would monitor Francoeur’s playing time over the next week, interested in whether or not manager Jerry Manuel follows through on his amended plan to let Francoeur face right-handed pitchers, a group he historically struggles against and is hitting just .217 against this season.

    “Talk to me is just that: It’s talk,” Fletcher said. “What matters is what happens and is he in right field every day. And that’s what we’re watching.”

    Wow. Just wow.

  39. @56 – Does Frenchie know that he’s destined to end up in Kansas City? I wonder if he would be so insistent on a trade if so.

    Also: I enjoy how his agent speaks about how “We want to play every day”. Excellent use of the royal we on behalf of a royal pain.

  40. I just don’t get why his agent thinks this is a winning strategy. They have no leverage, I assure you they have already tried to trade him, and now he comes off like a dick in case anyone IS interested. Dumbass

  41. This hurts Francoeur tremendously. Let’s say your a team that would like a 4th OF who might rebound his way into a starting slot if things go well. Are you going to take a chance on this guy after he sicks his mommy/agent on you? (BTW, I’m not trying to be sexists here. If his agent was male I would have said daddy.) If he’s unhappy unless he’s starting then he probably ought to learn Japanese.

  42. Joe thinks that Happ having to work to strand a lot of baserunners makes him a good pitcher.

  43. Oh, well. This game is much more tolerable with the Big Star/ Thirteen video. It actually lifts my depression just thinking of the line, I’ll be an outlaw for your love! Right now, only a sight of Farnsworth could spoil by mood.

  44. god, how awful must it be to be married to Jeffy?
    poor woman must sit there, listen to him ‘forcing the Mets hand’, she stares in awe and thinks “when did this guy turn into Napoleon Dynamite? god, just SHUT .. UP..”

  45. I Hated that AB. Brian took a protective swing at the 3-1 pitch (outside) like he was behind in the count, trying to stay alive.

  46. If I were Omar Minaya, that statement from Francoeur’s agent would be grounds for an automatic release.

    FWIW, Strasburg hasn’t been nowhere near as dominant as his MLB debut vs. the AAAA Pirates

  47. I seriously think Chip spends the night face down on his bed, kicking his feet in the air, writing little “clever” lines like that.

    *Let’s see..It’s Texas so it’s hot! and sweaty! .. OK… and fisted! I gotta get that in there somewhere. OK, let’s see what I got so far…….”

  48. I think Chip just has a book of “witty” sayings for broadcasters, only they aren’t witty at all and Chip is just too oblivious to realize it.

    He reminds me a lot of Michael Scott from The Office. Only it’s not as funny because it’s real.

  49. Exactly. Why not take advantage of what our infielders can’t do (anything but exchange oxygen with CO2)?

  50. Frenchy got in the Mets game as a pinch runner for Chris Carter (after a walk so I doubt it was an injury thing). How slow is Carter? Must be Glaus speeds we’re talking.

  51. JJ pitched 68, though allowed 5Hs, No problem. Hope at least he can go to the 7th. Please. What a SP.

  52. Maybe Chip could hire some gag writers? I’d be happy to volunteer.

    “And it’s another beautiful day for baseball, ladies and gentlemen. I just flew back from Houston, and Hartsfield-Jackson Airport couldn’t be more beautiful. Lemme tell you, you have to have an ugly city to make Hartsfield look good. And Heyward takes outside, 1-0. Yeah, that airport looks like Willie McGee. But Houston looks like Willie McGee with a neck beard. Heyward swinging, ground ball to the second baseman Uggla, throws on to first in time, one out.”

  53. Well, time for Chipper to take his sabbatical. His parents are in town and I guess they all wanted to ride back to the ranch and shoot some elk.

  54. You can’t be sure of course, but it didn’t look like his knee gave way which is what you fear. Looked like he just landed on the outside of his foot.

  55. He might be shelved for quite a bit, but I’d note that football players are different sorts of athletes. Also, it’s really, really rare for a guy to tear up his ACL and then walk, let alone run. A hyperextended knee is more likely.

  56. 152- We’re nine games up on third (the crumbling Mets) right now. You’re being too pessimistic.

  57. So in two weeks when we’ve lost 8 of 10 will it be then?

    This lineup sucks eggs and except for Hudson no SP is consistent and Minor isn’t the answer.

  58. 145 – I doubt anyone actually saw what happened so the first thing to check on is usually the knee. If they thought anything was amiss there, I really doubt Porter would let him walk out of the dugout on his own.

  59. Not broke apparently, but could be a ligament tear. Which might be good or bad (relatively speaking, of course). If this is truly his last season he might try to play out the season without surgery. I tore my ACL and cartilage in my knee a few years ago and didn’t have surgery for a couple of months. Granted, I’m not a professional ball player so that might make a huge difference as to how limited a ligament tear makes him. I was able to walk and work just fine, but I didn’t have to pivot and dive all over the place.

    But we’re probably doomed.

  60. I was at the game on Sunday and definitely saw Diaz shaking his right hand in apparent pain after a couple swings. It certainly seems like he some lingering effects from his thumb injury.

  61. Not only does this suck, but my fantasy baseball team is a collective 4 for 30 tonight and my only SP going tonight, Cueto got lit up like a Christmas tree. ARGHHHHHHHHHH.

  62. LOL, I have a delay on my broadcast. I saw Bethany yell Glaus and I just figured she was mad at him for a GIDP or something.

  63. What the heck, Glausaurus? Excuse me while I go board up the windows against the flying pigs.

  64. I know I’m gonna get pelted here, but when Troy started heating up in May, Didn’t it begin with a string of singles?

  65. McCann rarely makes the tag play at the plate. Again the defensive let down has cost them the lead

  66. Can we teach Freeman 3B between now and his call up next week? So McCann can play 1B?

  67. Good news is that the next batter, Carlos Lee, is the guy who Joe Posnanski just called the worst regular in the major leagues right now.

  68. McCann played 2B in high school, didn’t he?
    I remember a story of him playing 2B in one of those Georgia all star games with Francoeur

    if that’s so, he should play 1B.

  69. 217- The bad news is that he also started our worst “Send in the Clowns” moment last night.

    And he did it again.

  70. Make a f-ing play….you have got to be kidding me. They deserve to piss away the division with defense like this. And the Astros have hit like 1 ball hard and scored 2 runs and throwing away another game with bad defense is going to catch up with them eventually

  71. Oh dear fucking god. Atlanta Black Sox? Where the hell is Christy Mathewson when you need him?

  72. McCann fails at that play. Seriously annoys me to death how many times I’ve seen him botch that play at the plate.

  73. Yank AGony and put Diory Hernandez in there right now, Cox. An example needs to be made here.

  74. More Baghdad Bobby:

    “Bobby Cox tells MLB.com’s Steve Gartner that Alex Gonzalez has been excellent on defense since the Braves acquired him for Yunel Escobar last month.”


  75. That Bobby had THIS team in 1st place this late in the season is proof positive that most of you Bobby Haters no nothing.

    This team is old, slow, and weak.

  76. The more AGony presses, the worse his fielding gets. The worse his fielding gets, the more he presses.

  77. I have never seen a team do more with less good contact then the Astros have done the last 2 nights

  78. Wow….I’m so glad I can’t see this, but keep the comments coming I cannot stop laughing.

  79. I’m about ready for the Braves to use Hernandez at short for at least a few days. Let Gonzalez think it over for a while.

  80. Oh, my boy Ian shows up. Start to getting nervous. I feel as if I were treading on thin ice.

  81. Okay guys. Whoever thought it would be funny to have the Braves and Nats switch uniforms is an asshole.

  82. Pretty frustrating to lose a Jurrjens-Happ match-up. Wandy is probably going to no-hit us tomorrow.

  83. Wow Joe…the middle of the order coming up….


    We’ve got this one in the bag!

  84. Houston is the fattest city in America, it has awful traffic, and is home of Enron. (Watch the “Smartest Guys in the Room” about Enron if you want your blood to boil.)

    Of course if you want your blood to boil, keep watching this team play defense. If this wasn’t so gut wrenching it would be funny.

    Brooks Conrad makes me happy!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

  85. Do I want Gonzalez to score the tying run or do I want him to fail so that Cox might finally punish him for his stone glove?



  87. The most amazing thing about this game is still going to be McCann throwing out Pence at 3rd

  88. Brooks Conrad will hit the game winning walk off homer in game 7 of the World Series. You heard it here first.

  89. What the hell. Why not? We live in an age where six impossible things happen before breakfast.

  90. Smitty’s Sports Folk Hero Hall of Fame would like to welcome Brooks Conrad. Some other members:

    Al Wilson, Eric Berry, John Smoltz, Brett Smith, Joe Montana, Travis Stephens and several others.

  91. Wbo would have thunk that Conrad and Glaus would have saved the season (at least for the ).

  92. Glaus isn’t going to lose his incentives to a rookie if he has anything to say about it.

  93. To paraphrase Bismarck, God protects fools, drunks, and the Atlanta Braves. Tonight, at least.

  94. Brooks Conrad is the #1 worldwide trending topic on Twitter. And Brazil posts a lot of foolishness to Twitter.

  95. How can we not love Conrad?

    Come on guys, why don’t we want Glaus to do well?

    I like AAG, I really do, but this is getting ridiculous.

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