Arizona Diamondbacks vs. Atlanta Braves – Box Score – June 28, 2012 – ESPN.
Craig Kimbrel is human after all. I’m having a crisis of faith.
Jair Jurrjens had another “how does he do it” game. He didn’t strike anyone out, he walked three, and allowed six hits. And he allowed two runs, both on a double in the sixth. It makes no sense.
In the third inning, Brian McCann doubled in Martin Prado, and in the fourth Michael Bourn drove in Andrelton Simmons with a sac fly.
Chad Durbin finished the sixth, Kris Medlen pitched the seventh and most of eighth, Eric O’Flaherty finished it. And then Kimbrel gave up a one-out homer. Nonsensical.
John Jenkins? Oh, hell yes!
Amen.
That first part should be italicized — hank’s quote from the previous thread. Curse you again, lack of edit function!
I thought Mike Scott was a really nice pick at #43, too. I am encouraged by the first days of the Danny Ferry regime…
The Braves are boringly average (31-30 since April 21). They aren’t terrible, they aren’t particularly good. I guess that’s life under Liberty Media.
Here’s a question: let’s say the Braves get into the playoffs at, say, 84-78, get hot and win the World Series, a la St. Louis in 2006. Would people feel that the title was tainted? I would although I would still root for them.
Or it could be that we went through a ridiculously injury-plagued stretch and then even when we got healthier, our schedule became absurdly difficult.
I wouldn’t feel the least bit badly. I like that it’s not just the team with the best record in baseball at the end of the regular season that wins the title. I like playoffs where a lowlier team can win, and I don’t begrudge the Cardinals anything. We’re basically playing for the right to get hot and run the table.
Although I don’t see the point in speculating about the playoffs with this rotation.
@4
Tainted? Hell no. I would buy a shirt and would start all of my posts on here for a year like this.
“Well, another nuclear bomb went off in New York today, BUT WE ARE STILL CHAMPIONS OF THE WORLD!”
@4 – Tainted in what way? I wouldn’t feel that way. Someone from the Delgado-Teheran-Minor troika would need to step up in a big way for that to occur. I’m considering JJ toast at this point.
I like John Jenkins. I was really hoping Quincy Acy would slide far enough for the Hawks to get him in the second round. If Omar from the Wire were a real person, he would be Quincy Acy.
Getting sick of the Delgado-Minor duo at the back-end of the rotation.
4 — In fairness, FSN showed a graphic that said the last 42 games have been against teams with records above .500.
@4
I honestly can’t believe anyone would feel that way. If you do, that’s a you problem, not a system problem.
Meanwhile, back in the SEC….
http://blogs.ajc.com/uga-sports-blog/2012/06/29/georgia-tailback-isaiah-crowell-jailed-on-weapons-charges/
On a more positive note, Fangraphs has posted excerpts from an interview with Tim Hudson that’s worth a read: http://www.fangraphs.com/blogs/index.php/tim-hudson-the-evolution-of-a-repertoire/
Interesting take on Nats dominance in first half being a bit fluky. This poster puts up neat stuff a few times a year over at TC.
http://www.talkingchop.com/2012/6/29/3125757/i-wouldnt-worry-so-much-about-washington
I’m basically getting to the game tonight right on time. I have a parking permit , but I find the parking situation extremely confusing when the streets start getting blocked off. I’ll be coming up I-85 and parking in the Blue Lot. Is there anyone with enough “get-in, get-out” experience that can give me step-by-step directions on what I should do? Thanks in advance!
Richt seems to have trouble with the task of maintaining some semblance of order while simultaneously fielding a championship contender. He can do one, or he can do the other. Any early season losses that can be pegged to player suspensions will end up being his downfall — we’ve seen this exact cycle of events before, and he barely survived it last time.
So who are the Braves All Stars this year? Uggla might be voted to start, Kimbrel is a lock. Prado, Heyward, or Bourn maybe?
@14, if it were the red lot and you were southbound I could help you out… unfortunately northbound and blue lot are both beyond my expertise.
@ 14
I typically am travelling North on I-85 (actually I-75/I-85 by the time you get to Turner Field) when I go to games, and my best advice is to take Exit 246 (not 100% sure on the Exit Number but it is the exit for Fulton St). As you turn off of the exit onto the street, stay as close to the stadium as possible, because the Blue lot will be between you and the stadium to your right. If you can exit off into the right lane you should be able to turn right into the lot (assuming they don’t inexplicably close that entrance at game time). The Blue lot, for me at least, is the easiest lot to get into for this reason. I wish I could give advice on the getting out early part, because we rarely stay until the end of the game (we live 3+ hours away).
@14 Fulton St exit. Blue lot is a few hundred yards off exit. Easy in-out
Why is Jack Wilson starting at 2nd instead of Prado? Oh, that’s right Fredi is a mutha f’ing idiot.
I have a headache from beating my head against my desk after seeing the lineup today.
I get giving Uggla a day off. Of course it could have been done yesterday, cause you know, starting a series with the team you are chasing in the division.
to quote Charlie Brown “ARRRRRRGGHHH”
Nothing takes the taste out of peanut butter quite like unrequited love and watching Fredi Gonzalez manage.
– Charles Schulz
Jack Wilson is not a strategic nuclear weapon. He is a tactical nuclear weapon, and Fredi Gonzalez will deploy him on the battlefield unless he is disarmed.
According to Jayson Stark, we’ve been scouting Jason Vargas extensively.
Because we need more ridiculously homer-prone pitchers on the roster.
Liberty Media was just awarded $956 Million in a lawsuit against some French company. Maybe they could send just a wee bit of that cash to Atlanta?
“Scouting Jason Vargas” sounds like a sequel/reboot to “Raising Victor Vargas.”
It’s under appeal. They won’t see that for a while, if ever, and Liberty is sorta like Tony Soprano – money bubbles up from earners, not down to them.
Crowell’s been dismissed already, btw.
Prado’s out of the lineup today with a sore hammy.
Jack Wilson makes me miss Keith Lockhart and _that_ makes me suicidal.
Fredi has no clue … should have sit Uggla last night against diamondbacks and had him ready for Nats .. NO he is so stupid .. now he has both Uggla and Prado out tonight (Prado sore hammy i heard) .. it would be nice if we had a real mgr …… Bobby please come back ….
Regardless of what happens tonight, I’m glad we have Randall Delgado.
We never ever seem to catch the Nats at the right time.
Nice play Chipper.
I get that Uggla needs a day off, since he’s been struggling so badly.
But it does seem kind of stupid to wait until the team you’re chasing comes to town to start resting guys.
Prado’s been dealing with the hammy thing for “s few weeks.” Could have sat him yesterday. Could have sat Uggla or Chipper yesterday.
And according to DOB, its Prado and Uggla out tonight, Chipper resting tomorrow, and Sunday McCann gets a breather.
It just seems like a poor decision to wait until this series to get some rest for your horses.
Somehow, unlike Allstate insurance, I rarely feel in good hands with Randall Delgado. More like the opposite.
Delgado needs to be in AAA.
You’ve got to be kidding me, Bravos.
Nice job by the ump helping us out on that third strike call.
Figures…nice pitch Delgado, way to give up a hit to the stinking pitcher to put your team in a hole
Hey, I just invented a good strategy: don’t give up first-pitch RBI singles to the pitcher by throwing them a belt-high fastball.
I hope we trade Delgado and Minor for Greinke.
@33 I agree totally …. should had all the rest they needed against Diamonbacks and played all 3 games against the team thats ahead of you .. FREDI NO CLUE !!!!!! GONZALEZ
A bit of bad luck on some of the grounders but Delgado is throwing a ton of pitches. He won’t make it through 5 at this rate.
It would be good to score some runs for Randall. Looks like he’ll need a few.
Delgado is like Hanson if Hanson actually sucked.
He does nibble too much.
Way to go, Jack!
That was terrible, Jack.
Why do we always play like clowns against the Nats?
What a defensive clinic.
That’s clown defense, bros.
/drops mic
“That’s a clown defense, bro.”
I’m done. What a joke.
Buttermaker would have been pretty pissed about that inning. If he wasn’t drunk…
Delgado hasn’t actually been that bad tonight other than the nibbling. He is getting nothing defensively behind him.
Let’s bunt in the 3rd inning down by 3 runs!
I don’t think I can watch this anymore, either.
Defensive specialist Jack Wilson = epic fail
Oh, that was Delgado. Sorry, never mind.
Wilson brings nothing to the club.
Wait, we’re resting starters against the team ahead of us? I guess that’s so we have a built-in excuse when we’re 7 games out next week.
When are we gonna rest Fredi?
So what on earth makes them think Julio Teheran could possibly be worse than both of Delgado and Minor?
@60 or Redmond for that matter
I’d imagine Teheran would be just as bad, but has a higher ceiling. So it’s worth it for the Braves to let him continue to refine his breaking pitch in the minors.
Still trying to grasp what Fredi was thinking letting Uggla play last night against Arizona against a RHP .. and sit him tonight against the team you need to beat when a LHP is throwing !! fredi amazes me !!!!
Bravo’s just dont have it in big games … this is a big game after getting swept by them last time they were in ATL and needing to make a point that thats not acceptable .. we lay down and play like crap offensively and defensively .. just like we did at the end of last year when we needed a win to make playoffs … we choked … Gonzalex has no clue how to get his team ready for big games … Nats come to town and you rest your guys .. Uglla tonight, Chipper Sat and McCan Sun …. im scratching my head !!
@59 .. amen …. he’s useless !!!!
Bob Carpenter is insufferable.
Don’t worry, guys. We get Strasburg and Gonzalez the next two days. Everything will be fine.
My 1st live game of the year. 4-0, 3 errors, 98 degrees, no breeze. I can pick ’em, can’t I?
This is what happens when you bring a pillow to a gunfight
That was a nice escape, however.
wow … talk about laying down without a fight …. these guys are gutless … at least Uggla and Prado play hard every game …. we got no clue right now against these guys …. we will be 7 games out after this weekend … and again the Braves will try to be reactive instead of proactive in getting some help !!!!!
Simmons!
Do it, Andrelton.
After leaving so many on base early, glad he got that one.
Delgado gave up two runs. Clown baseball accounted for the other two.
Well, it will hurt now if we lose.
C’mon Jason, go boom.
Andrelton hadn’t been having a good game offensively before that, that’s for sure.
Then he makes up for it with one swing. Great game. Great kid. Let’s extend him. Yes, I’m feeling romantic.
Guess not, tonight.
/Go Braves!
Oh, good, it’s the old Chad Durbin.
You’ve got to be kidding me, Durbin.
Once again… Hanging Chad.
Prado at 2b for the first time in 2 seasons.
Looks like Durbin is returning to Earth.
Durbin never was good. The past six weeks were an illusion–show’s over.
Leave it to these Braves to draw me back in by pulling even, then completely failing.
I miss having a great bullpen.
So yeah, repeating an earlier sentiment, when does Fredi get a day off?
Oh, now we get Venters. Joy.
@85: Not true. He was pretty good in 2008. And I had a lot more hair back then too.
Burnett was not going to swing the bat and Venters still walked him. Pathetic.
Hope lives.
The Braves not only need help in the rotation, but they need a set-up man too.
Whew!
Rick Ankiel is a defensive specialist the same way Jack Wilson is.
Can we say that McCann has officially hit his decline phase?
Diaz is worthless.
It may not work out, but I like leaving Venters in here.
Matt Diaz aka 6-4-3.
I don’t know who these Heyward and Simmons guys are, but I think we should keep them.
Hinske: frickin’ useless.
Gonna have to find a mistake here.
Nuts.
Yeah… Hinske’s looking pretty much done.
Oh well. Get ’em next time.
way ta go Hinske ….. you gotta move that runner to 3rd … if you do we tie game you idiot
Good idea to send Hinske up instead of someone to bunt Freeman to 3rd so he couldn’t score on the fly ball that was hit two batters later. Idiot…
We’re going to get swept
Fredi’s tipping that cap.
Greetings from L.A…
Was keeping up with the Braves/Nats game as best as I could. Shared that awesome Simmons-HR moment, only to have it quickly dashed. Oh well… gotta go get ’em, Braves, tomorrow.
Saw R.A. Dickey do his thing at Dodger Stadium Friday night (8 IP, 0 R, 3 H, 1 BB, 10 K, to go 12-1 with a 2.15 ERA on the season). Was lucky enough to sit behind & above home plate & got to see that hard knuckleball dip & dart like a butterfly on meth all night. When LA pitcher Aaron Harang blooped a single, you could see how disappointed Dickey was—-everyone in the place who was paying attention knew that a no-hitter was a distinct possibility. He was pretty close to unhittable.
What was even more intriguing was seeing the looks on the Dodgers’ faces right after they struck out. Helpless, as if to say, “If you think catching that pitch is tough, just try to hit it.”
This is the second in-person Dickey effort I’ve seen this year (the first was, unfortunately, against the Braves). He’s really quite a story.
Bourn
Prado
Heyward
Freeman
uggla
Bmac
Simmons
Fransisco
Jason Vargas? Why would we scout him. I sure hope the 25 ER’s hes given up in his last 5 starts makes him dirt cheap.
I can’t believe they are going through with a 4pm start. It’s really, really bad today.
I hate Fredi… Maybe Juan K-sisco will reward Fredi by making contact once or twice today. Surprised Wilson isn’t starting too
We’d better do some damage now.
Nice at bat Jason
Mike Minor is such garbage
When Chipper sits, Fredi is in pick your poison mode. Prado can come to 3rd and the slumping duo of Hinske and Diaz aren available in LF, which is a huge defensive and offensive downgrade, or he can use Wilson or Fatcisco, who are the infield equivalents to Diaz and Hinske. What’s he supposed to do?
Has anyone said how much Minor sucks?
I was really just kidding when I compared Minor to JoJo a few months ago, but now…
@115… Good points… His hands are tied and i guess forgot Francisco got two hits off Strasburg the last time.
On a side note, the continued nibbling of Delgado and Minor is leading them to throw hitters count fastballs which is killing them. Try getting ahead in the count for once, like every pitcher seems to do to McCann
From now on, I’m going to refer to him as MiMi, in honor of JoJo.
Does Fredi even look at stats? Walking Flores to pitch to Strasburg is beyond brain-dead.
Frank Wren, scouting expert. Fatcisco missed that ball by 8 inches.
My first game watching on Peachtree. Camera work seems a bit amateur. Always like this?
I don’t expect Braves hitters to do much today, but Wren has a lot of work to do on our bench after he lands us a starter.
Minor escapes.
Ah, but the dreaded 4th inning is next.
@121 It’s the same production crew as the FSS/SportSouth broadcasts. But from the play-by-play man on down, I find their work to be amateurish compared to many other MLB regional broadcasts, particularly in the NL East (Marlins excepted; Rich Waltz is basically a louder Chip Caray).
No human being has ever deserved anything less than Minor deserved that double play.
He’s Horacio Ramirez, except he gives up more homers.
What happened to stealing bases. We
were running wild for a while there.
Jo-Jo Minor.
I like Mimi. That’s a good name for him.
HAHAHA. I was about to post about Strasburg’s no-hitter-in-progress when the double was hit. You’re all quite welcome.
Fredi did a relatively nice job on the lineup today.
What a great inning! Way to go, boys.
All 7,000 at Turner Field are loving the rally.
Waiting on Minor to cough this one up.
Brian McCann’s OPS+ is 85.
Walking Strasburg didn’t hurt, but I wish he’d had to run harder.
Russell Martin’s OPS+ is 85.
Strasburg is cooked. He gone.
I’d rather have Joe Simpson than Fredi as manager.
Looks like Strasburg wanted to go out but Davey Johnson yanked him. He looked like a zombie.
Can someone explain to me what’s going on. I’m at a bar with no volume.
Strasburg got pulled for, I guess heat, and they were arguing if Wang had unlimited warm ups.
It was unfair for us to start Minor against Strasburg. There was no way the Nationals could compete.
Now hopefully we can get Wang pulled.
@143, Uggla could probably point you in the right direction for that.
This is unexpectedly awesome.
@144 – that is hilarious. Just another Saturday night around here.
Is this the real life? Or is this just fantasy?
It would be nice if McCann stopped hitting like a…catcher.
Seriously, we went from Barves to Braves in the blink of an eye. Wha happen?
Huge shit!
Why isn’t Andrelton getting any all-star mention? The boy can play ball.
Good boy, Fredi. I was afraid you’d wait too long.
5 IP, 5 BB, 2 K
Mimi’s a lucky guy.
Well, this sucks.
This pitching staff is disgusting.
Whew!
Total Grybo appearance by Medlen, but at least the inning’s over. Thank God.
Oh, Jeez, Michael! What was that?
*sigh*
Even when Minor leaves with a lead, he’s destined not to win, perpetually with a cloud over his head. A modern-day Joe Btfsplk.
Durbin for the tie.
This is disgusting.
DISGUSTING!
Death by a thousand walks. Please take me now.
Eloi, eloi, lama sababraves?
Thank goodness.
@164 – you been day drinkin’, haven’t you?
Wow, great play by Simmons.
Better play that time, Michael.
Spike, how could you tell? I’m currently having an Epic imperial IPA at the bar half of a bar/liquor store in Tempe, Arizon
In the words of the Beatles, you know that can’t be bad.
This whole ‘speed on the basepaths’ thing is fun!
Nats announcers discussing McCann tipping the slider from Kimbrel.
WOOO! Way to go, Kimbrel!
Anyone wanna explain to me how we beat Strasburg and get beaten by Detwiler?
Seriously, great win. I love it when we hit. And there’s the Craig I know and love.
4.5 pitches per plate appearance against Strasburg. See what happens when you’re patient against a pitcher trying to work the corners, Braves?
Just got back from the game. We were told it was the hottest game in Atlanta Braves history. I believe it.
Great win today, but I didn’t see anything about yesterday’s loss. Not to beat a dead horse, but didn’t you guys think Fredi blew it on Friday in the 9th? Freeman gets the leadoff double and we don’t get him any farther even though we had two relatively deep fly balls. Wouldn’t a better strategy have been to put in a pinch runner for Freeman, use Wilson to bunt the runner to 3rd and take your chances after that? Hinske could have come in to play first if it went into extra innings. I’m not usually a big proponent of the bunt, but imo you’ve got to find a way to get the runner to 3rd when he’s on 2nd with no outs.
@ 150, just heard some chatter on baseball tonight about Simmons challenging Harper for the ROY. Plus they (ESPN)chose him as defensive player of the month over Trout and Phillips. Not that I put a lot of stock in what ESPN analysts say, and it may be to late for the ASG, but I think folks are noticing.
man, i’d really like the W today. the Nats are catching up to the Mets on my hate list.
A win today would be incredible. The Nats are not a dominant team and if our offense could be a little more steady we would definitely have a shot of staying in the hunt.
I’m trying to be optimistic because I feel like Freeman will rebound and so will Uggla.
This Heyward fellow is pretty good.
So what I’m gleaning from the current trade rumors is that if we deal Teheran/Delgado/Minor for Greinke/Garza/Marcum/Dempster, that means we’re going to make certain that we extend the player we trade for. Sounds good to me.
It’s a good thing Minor is a lefty. Someone is always willing to take a chance on a lefty.
I think most teams would be willing to take a chance on a 24 year-old righty who’s struck out 8.3 guys per nine over 209 major-league innings, too.
So, I’m minding my own business, reading about Dwight Howard’s weirdness here, when I stumble across this line:
WAT.
!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
Jim Powell says Ben Sheets is in uniform for the Braves today. Did I miss something?
DOB just tweeted that we signed him to a minor league deal. He’ll make his first start for Mississippi on July 4. (There’s a Chip Caray joke somewhere in there about July 4 and Sheets having pitched for team USA back in the day.)
Ben Sheets Reportedly Joins Atlanta Braves
http://mlb.sbnation.com/2012/7/1/3130039/ben-sheets-atlanta-braves-signs-free-agent
They just issued a press release. Signed him to a minor league deal.
omg melky cabrera is starting the all star game
It looks like Chipper will be in the mix for the final spot on the All Start team. We must send him.
Bourn didn’t make it either
This is not going to be a fun game.
Sheets to a minor league deal….sure, why not
I think I’m to blame. This has been one of those years where every game I get the free time to watch, the Braves play poorly. I bet they’re 10-20 in games I turn on or turn on in the middle innings.
Ballgame? Yes. Ballgame.
Holy bejeesus what a start.
Good thing we have our ace out there.
More like our deuce, or maybe joker.
Gotta love a pitcher killing the team’s chances before the hitters get to see even one pitch.
I don’t think Ben Sheets is the answer
The last thing we need is for Tim Hudson to start pitching like Mike Minor.
It’s like Nancy Sinatra said, these caps were made for tippin
“Bourn didn’t make it either”
That first inning play almost makes it look justified.
Yeah, it’s hard to believe that Ben Sheets is going to help much. He’s only made 20 starts in the last 4 years and hasn’t been good since 2008.
Holy hell what a great at bat by Simmons!
Andrelton is awesom
What a great AB by Simmons.
I think he broke Gio’s spirit.
Not enough, sadly. Damn. What an innin
Inning. Stupid phon
@203 Did Bourn misplay another ball? That’d be two in two days.
I am like Mac, I am having a crisis of faith…it is like I don’t care anymore because seems like this team will go nowhere this year…
211 — Yes, cost us a run.
This team is just bizarre. Pitchers are dominant one night and atrocious the next, the offense is off two nights and one one… Bleh.
No reason for Bourn to swing 3-0 there. Make him throw 2 strikes and keep him out there longer.
@212
I think we are going to be fine. We need a starter, a reliever and a bench bat.
I think the Nationals will cool off in the second half and we will pass them.
Sure is nice seeing Heyward being able to hit lefties now.
Hey a run!
I think Jason’s faster now than he was when he came up. Maybe he’s just a smarter baserunner.
@219 I agree, he does seem faster.
@183 Don’t forget about the home run rate, which is just as beneficial, if you’re the opposing team.
Chip = douche
The thing about Andrelton is, he’s probably as good or better at defense than Andrus and S. Castro, and probably as good a hitter, too. Seriously, is there a better under-24 shortstop in baseball?
Not a very apropos time for Tim Hudson’s “wowing everyone with another great pitching performance” radio ad.
Chip’s professional compared to the clown baseball the Braves are playing today.
The Braves have been at their worst against the Nats this year.
Hey now!
I’m really starting to hate the Nucking Fationals.
Everyone says the Nats will fade but at the very least they have much better pitching than the Braves. And Zimmerman and Morse are just starting to hit. They may not be dominant but neither are the Braves. And they have a better manager.
I don’t look at this team — before this series or after — and think they’re as good as the Nats. The ball’s in Wren’s court now.
We need two or three relievers, one or two starting pitchers, and two or three bench players.
There aren’t enough prospects in the whole International League to make this a championship caliber club.
@222, if he really can slug around 500 (and I am far from convinced) he’s one of the most valuable properties in the game.
Yeah, count me as a believer of the Nationals–but I was a believer before the season started. They have no glaring weakness, and sometimes that’s enough.
If Simmons can slug over 500, he’d be one of the three best players in all of baseball. As it is, he’s playing like a 9-win player right now.
@216. We really need Venters to be the Venters we know….
We signed Ben Sheets; we’re saved!
I still feel like we need a middle-of-the-order bat too. And a new manager.
I don’t think it’s possible to plug all the holes in our pitching staff, so let’s see if we can out-slug everyone instead.
Has anyone checked on Mac?
220—Not sure why you’d assume I’m forgetting about anything. I was only pointing out that left-handedness isn’t the only thing appealing about the 24 year-old.
DOB thinks the Braves will join the pursuit for Greinke, esp if the Braves can extend him for $15mil/per or less. If not, the Braves have still been scouting Liriano.
I just wish he’d taken the class on finding the strike zone while he was at Vanderbilt.
Seriously, how are none of the Braves’ OFs on the All-Star team? That is just ridiculous.
I hate to admit it but I think this team needs too many pieces to compete till the end .. Neither EOF or Venters are as reliable as last year .. and we dont hae a real shutdown #1 starter .. we have some guys who you could say would quality as a 2 or 3 on a staff but we have no depth there in the starters and when dont have a true #1 you in trouble .. now the other weakness .. BENCH .. Hinske, Wilson and Francisco are just not adequate .. Ross is a great #2 catcher and Diaz has a few moments but the 3 guys mentioned are far from quailty subs .. therefore we dont enough in farm system to trade for some guys to help .. therfore hopefully we gat a strong pitcher and OF bat next year with the surplus money we should have ..
If Danny Ferry trades Joe Johnson without taking back a big longterm salary then he will instantly become my favorite Atlanta area GM. Of all time.
Can see it: the Braves lock up the 2012 NL East title on the 8,233rd post in the ‘Diamondbacks 3, Braves 2’ thread.
Braves NL WAR Updates (Last updated June 28th)
Bourn- 5th (same)
Prado- 6th (same)
Heyward-8th (same)
Uggla- 20th (Up 1)
Simmons-39th! (Up 21!)
Chipper-43rd (Up 6)
Freeman-60th (Up 15)
McCann-79th (down 9)
Simmons is on pace for about a 7 WAR season
“I don’t think it’s possible to plug all the holes in our pitching staff, so let’s see if we can out-slug everyone instead.”
They tried that a few years. Didn’t work out so well.
I’m not surprised none of the Braves outfielders made the team because they don’t have the stats that people making the decisions look at. No one is looking at WAR. I am surprised Bourn didn’t make it because he does have good counting stats. One problem, of course, is the silly rule that every team has to have a player on the All-Star team as if this is Little League.
I can barely stand that ASG anyway. I watch a little bit of the HR derby and usually can’t get past an inning of Joe Buck and Tim McCarver…
@243 No kidding. The link “Sources: Nets pursuing Joe Johnson trade” looks like a link from the Onion.
Ennui. I have it, and it’s the Braves’ fault.
Well, at least Freeman is starting to crawl back out of the abyss.
From MLB Trade Rumors:
“Count Bryce Harper among Chipper Jones’ supporters for his bid to be added to the National League All-Star roster through the Final Vote competition, writes Mark Zuckerman of NatsInsider.com. The 19-year-old rookie, who is competing with Jones for a spot on the team, said that a future Hall of Famer should be able to go to the All-Star Game during his last season. “If I was going to make a vote, I’d go vote for Chip.””
#250: Damn, what a doucheba- actually, wait, that’s not that douchey.
Melky Cabrera is starting for the NLs so this year’s All-Star Game does not exist for me.
Does it bother anyone else that 16 year old non-Americans can be signed by Major League teams?
@253
And not have to be drafted. American players are getting a raw deal.
@253:
In a ‘its unfair to American players’ way or a ‘too many foreigners in baseball; give me the Georgia boys’ way?
Or in a “16 years old is pretty early to be signing contracts that can last until 30” way.
If you’re under 18 when signing, the team gets 5 years of MILB off the 40, 3 option years, and six MLB years.
The Braves, working with diminishing payrolls, reacted with restraint to last September’s collapse, but some in the industry believe that a second straight failure to reach the postseason could jeopardize GM Frank Wren.
From Rosenthal’s column today.
I’m pretty sure it doesn’t give Americans a raw deal. I’m pretty sure, actually, that the issue is signing non-American 16-year olds to contracts because U.S. child labor laws don’t apply to them. And yes, I have a problem with it. But let’s now see here who has a problem with child labor laws…
Would rather see Gonzalez go than Wren.
Would you guys be OK with the Braves re-signing Bourn and Ross, trading for Greinke, and signing someone like Swisher/Quentin to play LF if it meant that McCann were to be traded in the offseason and Gattis/Ross split time behind the dish? With the payroll flexibility that a McCann trade would give the Braves, it could feasibly happen.
I think it’s unfair to both. Clearly, signing 16 year olds creates a potential (and, I suspect, a reality) of exploitation. At the same time, American players are subject to a draft that limits how much they can get when foreigh players aren’t. The guys that benefit from this system are the Cubans and the Japanese who are typically older and better able to take care of themselves. I have no problem with them making money but it’s certainly unfair to the Bryce Harpers and Stephen Strasburgs. All this draft slotting would be nothing less than collusion if there weren’t a collective bargaining agreement and an antitrust exemption.
@ 258
I know this could end up in the same area code as political discussion, but I believe (not 100% sure) Federal child labor laws apply through the age of 15. Once you turn 16, for the intents and purpose of labor law, you are an adult. I’m sure there are many states that go beyond this minimum in terms of regs for workers under 18. What keeps American kids from dropping out and signing pro contracts at 16 would be, I’m assuming, state educational requirements where enrollment in secondary education is mandatory through age 18.
Right on cue…
http://www.baseballamerica.com/blog/prospects/2012/07/braves-sign-venezuelan-righthander-yeralf-torres/
I’d love Swisher. Quentin has Nick Johnson-esque levels of proneness to injury. I don’t want him.
And I agree with #258 and #261, but I won’t elaborate out of respect for the No Politics rule.
I’m worried that Wren will overpay in a trade situation if he feels he’s on the hot seat.
I think what keeps American kids from signing contracts at 16 is their parents who won’t let the teams exploit their children.
Harper got his GED, I believe, at 16 and then went to junior college so he was able to sign at 17. He’s pretty exceptional though. But if he wasn’t subject to the draft, he would have gotten a lot more money.
The draft itself is what keeps teams from exploiting American kids.
You can call it exploitative, but for a lot of the kids getting signed, it’s a much better option than what would otherwise be a life of near-certain poverty.
The real “exploitation” is with American kids not getting paid what they’re worth on the open market. The new draft system is actually going to end up being pretty good at curtailing signing bonuses, so the result is kids aren’t going to get paid what they should. Between this and the NCAA limit on college scholarships to baseball players, this will mean relatively fewer elite American athletes that end up playing baseball.
On the foreign side, the limits they’re placing on spending there could turn out to be a real disaster. It’ll either mean more corruption (clubs funneling money to buscones, etc. illegally even more than goes on now) or fewer money invested in foreign players/scouting, meaning fewer opportunities for foreign players to either be drafted or get jobs working in the baseball industry. (Or most likely both.)
Basically, the new CBA makes owners marginally richer (in a mutli-billion dollar industry, the savings are essentially pocket change) and the players, both foreign and domestic, get less.
Hooray, Andrelton!
http://espn.go.com/blog/sweetspot/post/_/id/26348/braves-rookie-simmons-already-elite-ss
Wren won’t overpay if he feels he is on the hot seat. He isn’t the final say so.
If we miss out on the playoffs, he and Fredi both will be in trouble.
@266- I don’t think there’s anything that American parents have that Dominican parents don’t have. Well, other than options.
McCann is hitting 7th today.
Yep
Bourn
Prado
Heyward
Chipper
Freeman
Uggla
Bmac
Simmons
Hanson
Moving Uggla and BMac down seems like the right thing to do for now. Props to Fredi. I’d also bat Simmons higher than 8th, just seems like hitting in front of the pitcher might be tough for a young guy that likes to hack.
If only there was a 10th and 11th spot in the order… and if only those 10 and 11 spots didn’t have to hit… or play defense…
need a two start fantasy option for this week
Matt Moore vs NYY and @ Cle
Andrew Cashner @ Ariz and vs Cin
After thinking about it, I think mravery may be correct; they might not be getting what they will be worth ultimately but sometimes a dollar now is more important than five dollars later. No one is likely to pay top dollar for a 16 year old kid; but the money he gets at 16 might keep his family out of poverty. But it depends on whether the teams have programs in place to take care of these kids. It’s sort of like the question of whether people benefit from American factories in developing countries that provide jobs but at much lower pay.
@266,
I think options are important.
As long as individual clubs are permitted to build academies and concentrate scouting in particular areas, they’re going to have an uneven playing field to exploit, leading to a greater chance that a kid from that area will sign for a lot less than he could get in a truly open market. That said, those clubs made the effort, and it would be hard to tell them they can’t benefit. No easy solution.
It’s time to stuff the ballot boxes for Chipper, guys.
http://www.mlb.com/vote
Just did, at least 20-25 times
I never post….but out of concern, is Mac ok?
Hawks have traded Joe Johnson according to ESPN.
@260 – I like it except that Swisher’s next contract will be at the market rate for a guy on the wrong side of 30. Don’t know that I want to watch him and Uggla get old at the same time. Wouldn’t mid paying Grienke what he’s worth, though. Team’s got to have an ace.
http://espn.go.com/new-york/nba/story/_/id/8124182/brooklyn-nets-agree-trade-atlanta-hawks-joe-johnson-sources-say
Nice.
Well, that was bizarrely easy. Nice work, new guy!
I mean, it was a given that we were going to spend the next four years paralyzed by the Johnson contract, and Ferry took care of it in, like, a weekend.
@284 – “Sources say” always scares me, but if this really goes down, I will wear a Danny Ferry Duke jersey to a UK home game next year.
Based on their mlb.com pictures, we’ve got a real mullet battle going tonight.
Dsle Murphy adds to the broadcast team. He and Joe almost make up for Chip.
Looks like Marvin’s out, too. Ferry doesn’t waste any time.
Nice hustle, Dan.
I think I’m ready for Ross and McCann to swap roles.
Congratulations on your first career stolen base, Andrelton!
Gah, a gift then some bad luck.
Tommy’s pitching well, but it is the Cubs. Andrelton continues to impress me with his game.
Note to self: never ever praise Hanson.
Love him so far, but that was some Little-League baserunning from Simmons there. You’re taught to break back to the bag; if it gets through, you’re going to score anyway.
Speaking of head-up-your-add moments, here’s a Chi Sun-Times column (from a month ago) on Starlin Castro’s litany of on-field sins:
http://tinyurl.com/7pnt2sc
He seems to do better when I throw venom at him, whether he deserves it or not.
You suck Tommy! A homer? What’s up with that?!
HANSON DON’T YOU DARE WALK THE PITCHER!
the Hawks could now deal Horford, a 1st, & some of the expiring deals for Dwight Howard…and then go hard after Chris Paul next summer.
A few runs would be nice, Braves.
The Braves look completely baffled at the plate. I don’t think we’ll be getting anything off this guy. He’s on his game.
Nice swing, Dan.
OMG, just read the news too. Danny Ferry has become my favorite Atlanta GM in a weekend. Getting rid of BOTH Joe and Marvin? Amazing.
Now, Wren, do something good.
We can’t lose to the mother effing Cubs.
Nitram!
Our two non-all stars do go work once again.
Love the 2-out rally, modest as it may be.
Tommy pitched six nice innings.
307- And yet this guy LaHair is an All-Star, by the simple expedient of having virtually all of his teammates suck.
Hanson’s decided that now it’s time for an Episode!
Given how Hanson gets progressively worse the more times he faces an order in a game, I wouldn’t object to him becoming a reliever at some point.
How did he manage to not even touch that ball?
I’d love to love Hanson. This kind of inning won’t help me.
Whatever McDowell told Hanson obviously worked wonders.
Well, that was a disaster.
How can things go to hell so quickly? Hanson should never be allowed to pitch past six.
Looks like I picked the wrong night to stop crying myself to sleep.
man i hate this team
This is why some of us hate Tommy Hanson. He is the opposite of clutch.
He does none of the small things well. He’s got to be the worst hitter in baseball. He barely even tries to bunt, and when he does, its as likely to be a DP as it is to be a success. He can’t field his position. Any baserunner is a stolen base threat, because he doesn’t hold runners AT ALL.
And he never seems to pitch the shutdown inning after the Braves score. Chase all game, tie it up, and he’ll load the bases with nobody out.
This is the most fucking Tommy Hanson inning ever pitched.
And I hate him.
The moral of the last two days is this: the Braves have no truly trustworthy starters who aren’t on the DL.
I hate this team.
I guess the fact that he’s our best pitcher pretty much says it all.
I know the stats say that we’re a decent offensive team, but we sure do score 3 runs or less an awful lot. Once a week we’ll drop 10+ on someone, but in between there’s a lot of shit shows like tonight’s.
Way to lock the door once the horse has run away, Tommy.
I hope they don’t move any good prospects to try to salvage this season. This team is 3-4 players away.
It would be nice if we scored occasionally.
Agree with jj at 324.
Freddie Freeman, STOP SWINGING AT EVERY F*CKIN’ PITCH!
Do we have any good prospects left? I don’t see how we could possibly make a trade. We’re gonna try to find a few reclamation projects like Ben Sheets and hope one of them pans out. If the season goes to hell them maybe we can trade Bourn or McCann or something. I dunno what Wren can do.
I’m not sure we have many good prospects left to trade.
At least the Hawks did something good today.
Our All-Star-To-Be doubled. Shame we couldn’t do anything with it.
This team blooooooooooooooooooowwwwwsssss
Our offense frustrates me almost as much as Hanson.
We could trade Pastornicky. For a box of rocks and some shiny things.
Dear Brian McCann,
Learn how to hit again.
Love,
Braves fans everywhere
loosing record at home …. and we cant even beat the lowly Cubs at home … boy this team has some issues … from Mgr on down … can we play all games on road please … if mgmt starts loosing some money then maybe !!! naw nevermind !!
Let’s face it, this is just not a good team. Offense sporadic, pitching not very good, managing poor. The Braves talk a better game than they play.
@337 They are an above average team which will not win anything…much like the Hawks until what has happened today.
In some slightly better news, our old friend Brooks Conrad tied up the TB/NYY game with an RBI double, and then scored the go-ahead run. Now 4-3 TB.
Playoff teams don’t lose games to the Cubs with their best starter on the mound.
Clutch, Chipper.
Oh, the humanity.
@338, Not to say that the Braves should do what the Hawks did today…but it’s funny because I don’t really follow basketball, and still my general impression is that the Hawks are kind of like the Braves. Built to be competitive, a couple big contracts weighing the team down to some degree, but in a league where the best teams are stacked, the Hawks don’t seem to me to have much of a chance to win a championship, if we’re all honest about it.
MLB is dramatically different from NBA. When it comes to the post-season, MLB is more like the NHL.
If you’re a lower-seed playoff team after a full season, you’ll never win a title in the NBA, like never. If you get into the playoffs at all in MLB or NHL, you have a chance.
@337 and @338 .. agree with both …. sadly have to admit it !! Maybe if they spend money wisely next year we can improve some.
Tomorrow is beggin for Phil Collins
Anybody know how Mac is doing? It’s been 3 days since he’s posted anything.
Screw the Braves. I’m worried they’re gonna make a crazy trade under the delusion that they’re playoff caliber, but I also don’t care that much anymore. Ennui, bitches.
Nominated for new tagline.
How many times have teams won their division with a losing record at home? Once again the braves offense has been shut down. Look like they can sweep the dbacks and then lose 4 of 5. One starter wont help this bunch.
I forgot all about he monday issue, now 0-11
Well Zach Greinke gave up 5 runs in his first three innings tonight. Liriano gave up 5 last night in 5 innings.
Oughta just go get both guys. They’d fit right in.
I don’t think they would make a midseason manager change, would they?
Technically, if we replace Minor with Greinke, we should expect that that should result in four more wins for the Braves if both pitchers keep going at their current rate of success (or “success,” in Minor’s case). If the rest of the team keeps on as is, that’d get us in the conversation.
To go deep into the playoffs, it’d be ideal if Hanson was our third starter. That would mean a major comeback from Sheets…
I despise Fredis tactics as much as the rest but what has he actually done wrong in the last month? The one thing might be the lack of a bunt attempt with Freeman at 2nd,0 out, but it would be odd for this board to condemn him for that. I mean,the dude has tried everything.
Also, how long does it take before Freddie gets the Heyward treatment? He has been awful against LHP. It’d be for the Braves to give Meija a shot at claiming a bench spot/spot start at 1st.
@349 Hah, it’s got my vote.
I predict that Delgado will perform splendidly in his next start, giving us a small ray of hope, only to crush us by returning to mediocrity for the next 5.
@355 it is not even the tactic issue anymore. Fredi’s team is just incredibly inconsistent.
It’s weird how I always forget words when I post using my iPhone.
Has it been a month since the Livan usage incident that Chipper more or less said deflated the whole team?
Worth saying again: It’s not that Fredi is the team’s worst problem — because he isn’t — but this team really can’t afford more screw-ups than the average team gets from its manager, whether it happens early in the season, now, or later.
@349: “Ennui, bitches.” Nominated for new tagline.
I laughed out loud. That seems to be the PERFECT tagline for this team.
“I do believe in you… I just know you’re gonna fail.”
It’s too early to write off the season but at some point you are what the record says you are. This is basically a .500 team. How long can you talk about how much talent you have but for some reason don’t win games? But maybe this is the year the Braves catch fire in the second half and streak through the playoffs. Stranger things have happened but I’m not holding my breath. It’s just so damn discouraging.
I think Chipper summed this team up really well yesterday:
“Just the inability to put all three facets together at the same time. And do it consistently, every…single…day. And for whatever reason, it’s just not happening. We get a good pitching performance, we don’t swing the bats. We get a good pitching performance, we don’t play defense. We swing the bats, we don’t pitch. It’s frustrating. But if the guys in this clubhouse want to get to where we want to go, we better start playing better.”
And this:
“…this team at times plays brilliantly. We play great. And then other times, we more resemble the Bad News Bears. And that doesn’t cut it up here.”
Also, I hope things are okay with Mac. This is not typical of him to be absent for this long without checking in. Has anyone heard anything from him?
@347
I’m worried about Mac also – here’s hoping he’s closeted in a secret meeting with Greinke’s agent working out an affordable long-term extension for the Braves because Wren needs ‘plausible deniability’ for his Liberty Media overlords.
I still can’t believe Ferry managed to offload both Joe and Marvin…when was the last time we were surprised like that?
Mac, we are all thinking of you. All the best.
I think Fredi’s poor tactical management has to have been picked up on by veteran players. You don’t think Chipper was wondering where the hook was last night?
It’s like Fredi manages the game he hopes will happen. He talks in the paper about needing pitchers to go deeper, so he leaves them in until they blow up. He hopes a big hit will win the game in exciting fashion, so he sends up Hinske instead of someone to bunt.
He’s just…. a dingle berry.
The perfect tagline for this team is that line from Gameday or whatever:
In play: out(s)
Ive never seen an offense that just swings at every pitch thinking they are getting nothing but fastballs, esp w/ RISP. Watch tonight as soon as someone gets on base this team will start swinging for the fences. Remember when this team use to try and clog the bases?
Go figure, we’ve lost 4 of 5 and the only win was against Strasburg.
I don’t think players should be worrying about the manager’s tactical decisions. They should be trying to play well enough so that his decisions don’t matter. I think players are much more concerned about how the manager treats them behind closed doors.
“Go figure, we’ve lost 4 of 5 and the only win was against Strasburg”
But Strasburg was almost unconscious from the heat.
@368. They would not be human if they are not aware. We would all notice if our boss sucks at what he does.
Fredi is a buffoon and all but lets be honest… what manager could win with this starting rotation? The roster has some huge holes and that’s on the GM.
I’m sure most players think of mistakes made by Fredi (or Bobby) as just part of the game, just the same as if one of them had committed an error on the field. It’s probably just as deflating if it becomes a routine thing. The only difference is that there’s no clubhouse leader who can approach Fredi with stuff he tends to muck up more routinely.
Our old rain delay from the TBS days has died. So long Andy Griffith, thanks!
Has anyone checked on Mac? Can someone write a recap or put up a new thread?
Just popping in to say I’d trade Julio Teheren for Zach Greinke, no questions asked.
Do I need to drive to B’Ham to check on Mac?
Mac’s been silent for a while now, Sam. Hopefully, silence means all is well.
Is there any way we can get an update on Mac today?
I noticed the lack of recaps for the last two or three days. Un-Maclike. Seriously, if I’m the closest geographically to run over to B’ham and check, I can find a day to do that before too long. His FB hasn’t been updated in a while either.
Please, someone, check on Mac.
Hanson is about the worst pitcher when behind in the count that I can remember. If the count gets to 2-0 or 3-1, he just grooves it. And they hit it; boy do they hit it.
Thank you, Sam. I checked his facebook also and saw no updates.
Anyone have Mac’s cell#? Dont post it on here, but give him a ring and update us if you dont mind. Ive been here a long time and cant recall him not providing updates and new recaps, esp. after losses like these.
Can anyone contact someone who can contact Mac directly? Stu, Alex R, AAR?
I assume Stu or Alex would be the guys with the most up to date connection info, being the secondary recappers?
Alex R. AAR, Stu anything from Mac?
Nothing on my end. Been trying to contact him for a couple of days.
That’s disturbing, Stu.
New, unimaginative-even-for-me thread is up.