Braves 14, D-Backs 0

ESPN – Braves vs. Diamondbacks Box Score, July 29 2007 – MLB

This does not mean that the Braves don’t need another hitter.

The Braves scored in each of the first seven innings and chased our old pal Livan after four. After Chipper drove in a run with a sac fly, Andruw hit a two-run homer to give the Braves a 3-0 in the first, and they cruised from there. Chipper hit a bases-loaded double in the second. Even Woodward and Thorman got into the act; Woodward doubled in Escobar in the sixth and scored on a wild pitch, and Thorman hit a pinch-hit homer in the seventh.

The Braves finished with nineteen hits, with all the regulars (as you’d expect) contributing at least one. Chipper was 1-1 with two sac flies before leaving the game to rest, and had five RBI. Francoeur had three hits, and five Braves — Harris, Renteria, KJ, Escobar, and Thorman, the last two off the bench — had two.

Tim Hudson didn’t have any real problems, going seven and allowing just three hits and one walk, striking out five. He needed just eighty pitches. You know, if you’re going to try for a complete game, this might have been the time.

The Braves designated Fredo for assignment and called up Ascanio, who pitched the eighth. They seem to hope that Ledezma will clear waivers and can be converted to a starter. The McBride deal looks worse and worse. Wickman, for some reason, pitched the ninth… Teixeira update: the Braves had to pull Matt Harrison back after he developed shoulder tendinitis. Since they won’t trade Reyes, the deal has to be reworked some. Most people still seem to think it will happen.

247 thoughts on “Braves 14, D-Backs 0”

  1. Mac, why on earth are you up so early?

    Thanks Mr Harrison for hurting your shoulder at the most important time. He must really want to stay as a Brave. However, I wish he can develop a third pitch. Otherwise, I hope JS can deal him away when his value is high. I don’t understand why some people prefer Harrison more than Reyes, but Harrison is only a two-pitches pitcher right now…which explains his low strikeout rate. I think Dan Smith will be included in the deal now, and he is actually better and more advanced than Harrison.

  2. In my personal humble opinion, I think the only pitching prospect at and above class A we MUST keep is Thomas Hanson. I still have a lot of faith in JoJo.

  3. Fine with me — I’m leery of giving up our three best prospects in the same deal. Heck, I’m still hoping it’s Lillibridge instead of Andrus (which it isn’t, I know).

    McBride-for-Ledezma, given that it was a nothing-for-nothing trade to begin with, can only look so bad.

  4. Our 3 best prospects are Salty, Escobar, and Davies. You could make a case its Reyes instead of Davies certainly. You could even argue that Thorman is one of them. It isn’t Andrus or Harrison.

    And you’d rather give up Andrus than Lillibridge? Really? You’d rather give up an 18 year old single A shortstop hitting

    .241/.328/.331/.659

    than a 23 year old AAA shortstop who has hit

    284/.375/.442/.817 with 5 HR, 20 RBI, and 18 steals

    since he was called up to Richmond?

    Lillibridge is a better prospect than Escobar. Andrus doesn’t even yet deserve to be in the same discussion as those two. 4 or 5 years from now if he unexpectedly develops the ability to be a good hitter then we can talk, but why should anybody care about such a distant future? Right now he projects to be Pete Orr or Rafael Belliard. That’s who you want to hold back and endanger a trade to get Mark Teixeira? I don’t get it.

  5. Ron, you are a bit too harsh on Andrus. You are not really comparing apple to apple because Lillibridge is a 23 years old AAA shortstop while Andrus is a 18(!!!) years old single A shortstop. You are talking about a high school senior facing pitchers who are normally three or four years older than him.

    I agree he has not developed as fast as we have hoped, but comparing him to Orr and Belliard is a bit too superficial.

    I like both Lillibridge and Andrus, and I think Andrus has a higher ceiling than Lillibridge. However, Lillibridge is a more advanced than Elvis. I rank them as more the less equal.

  6. Also, Furcal never displayed any kind of power in the minor (total of THREE HRS in the minor), and he ends up consistently hitting around 12-15 hrs per season.

    So, you can’t jump to any kind of conclusion purely based on minor league stats. Reputation and opinion from scouts deserves some weight in assessing minor league talents.

  7. Hanley Ramirez is another example. I would say Andrus’s ceiling may not be as good as Ramirez, but Ramirez is pretty damn good.

  8. “Nothing” is now ahead of “Sell”…

    Andrus is the kind of player who frightens me, because there’s maybe a five percent chance that he becomes a superstar, but probably better than even that he never becomes as good of a player as Escobar or Betemit, neither of whom is an All-Star. And like Betemit, he’s on a fast track because his career started so early; while he’s 18, he has to be in the majors for good at 22.

  9. I definitely agree with you Mac. That’s why I don’t have problem with trading him away while his perceived value is still high. I just think he deserves a bit more love from Ron. Comparing any players to Orr and Belliard is harsh in my eyes…except for Woodward.

  10. #4

    According to Baseball America, our three best prospects are Salty, Harrison, and Andrus — the same three players who’ve been discussed as the trade chits.

    Yes, I would rather have Andrus than Lillibridge, because I believe Yunel can man shortstop adequately as a bridge between Edgar and Elvis.

    Andrus is playing against people 2 and 3 years older than he is, and plays at maybe the worst hitting park in baseball. Here are his home/road splits:

    Home
    .176/.262/.235
    Away
    .292/.374/.411

    He is, by all accounts, a defensive whiz. As Mac says, his ceiling is higher than Lillibridge. I’m more interested in building a long-term championship team than in barely limping into the postseason this year, absolutely.

  11. I also agree and am not sold whatsoever on Andrus, like many in here are. I am perfectly OK with Jon Daniels taking Elvis to the Rangers.

    I came into work a bit later then I normally do this morning so I could hear Buster Olney’s trade deadline update on “Mike & Mike” this morning.

    This is essentially what Olney said this morning:

    He started talking about how John Schuerholz, more than any GM in Baseball, doesn’t ‘play games’ and when he makes an offer, he makes a fair offer and that’s that. He said the rangers have now had the Braves final offer for 3 days and Jon Daniels has been sitting on it–which explains Salty sitting on the bench.

    Olney thinks the Rangers will pull the trigger with us, but he did say that the longer Daniels sits on his hands and makes JS wait, JS will come back with another surprise offer and that Schuerholz has done that before–bottomline, you don’t make John Schuerholz wait, buddy.

    My assumption, like everyone is the trade would be Salty, Andrus and Harrison for Teixeira and CJ Wilson (which let me say again what a fantastic trade this would be for the Braves…please, God, make this happen), but maybe stupid Matt Harrison and his stupid tendinitis are now holding things up. We shall see. I don’t see any reason not to upgrade the pitching part for Texas if they balk on Harrison–it’s still a great deal.

  12. Olney also said the only other team really in this with the Braves for teixeira is the Angels, but he said things we’ve already pointed out:

    1. Bill Stoneman, the Angels GM, is the most conservative GM in Baseball and won’t budge from any offer

    2. The Braves are offering the better overall package

    3. Daniels REALLY doesn’t want to trade Teixeira to a team he’ll see 19 times a year and that gives us the biggest edge.

  13. I am actually shocked to learn Stoneman went as far as offering Kotchman and Saunders if it indeed happened.

  14. Get off you ass, Daniels and sign the papers. He’s costing us by having to keep Salty out of the line-up for fear of getting hurt. Jeezum crow.

  15. Hopefully, when I get home from work later, I will be reading about today’s trade.

  16. I think that if Baseball America did their top prospects list now, things might be different. Hanson has really emerged, and is the kind of pitcher (one several years from the majors) they really like. Reyes had passed Harrison as well, though I don’t know if BA would have agreed. And Lillibridge came over after the list was compiled.

    I think we could sell the Rangers on Lillibridge. Think about it, if they had him and Saltalamacchia to go with Frank Catalanotto, they could make extra money on special, wider scorecards.

  17. Well, Arlington isn’t so bad, Waco is a nice little town (outside the David Coresh stuff)

  18. If this trade happens today, is someone going to break into the Ted and set the press box on fire?

  19. Smitty,

    Oh, I’ve been many times…I have family in Plano and it’s nice. Not my favorite area, but fine.

    Waco Sucks…no one who has ever been to Wacko can ever have anything nice to say about that little town.

  20. good morning…I’ve avoided the tex trade all weekend and feel great that I did. It was getting exhausting. This morning it is sounding better. My sense is that Daniels is just waiting in hopes that he does not have to include Wilson. I’d also bet that JS has told him that we will move on if necessary and probably is working in the background on a play B.

  21. The Arlington area is nice. I used to live in The Colony, TX. Nice place.

    The Ballpark in Arlington (err… what is it now? Ameriquest Field?) is also pretty damn cool. And I’m sure it will help Salty’s career.

  22. JoshQ-

    I hope you’re right…as badly as I want Tex, this is the ultimate game of Texas (Atlanta) Hold ‘Em and I think JS is playing a great game of poker.

    JS has to make Daniels feel as if “fine, we are moving on to another deal if you sit on your ass” in order to get this on. With JS’ calm demeanor and years of experience, I trust JS will pull this off with Wilson or a very good reliever mixed in–that’s not Ron Mahay.

  23. I don’t mind Mahay, actually (but rather have Wilson, certainly.) He’s got good numbers this season and coming into this league from the AL ought to help him initially. Mahay is better than no reliever.

  24. We have no lefthanded reliever; I agree with JS that in this division that’s a very bad idea. Mahay would be useful, and there’s nothing wrong with useful, even though Wilson has a much better chance of long-term usefulness.

  25. The reason why I think this is because if the trade had been Salty, Andruw, Harrison for Tex alone, I really think it would have been completed already. That is too good of a deal to not just take if you are Texas. My bet is that there is a 3 for 2 trade written in pencil and Daniels is stalling in hopes that someone else jumps in at the last second. He is obviously gambling that JS doesn’t have anything else on the back burner. After watching how JS works over the years, I find it hard to believe that he isn’t on the phone with other GM’s in between talks w/ Daniels. He may not have a blockbuster somewhere else, but would it surprise any of you if he traded for Damaso Marte 30 minutes after a Tex deal fell through.

  26. See, I think if we were to just wait for the off-season, we could make a much better move. I say hold on to Salty, get him ABs at first, and cross your fingers.

    Then come December, try to move Salty for someone like Snell or Gorzo or Chris B. Young or Kotchman + low-level pitching prospect or something along those lines. Notice all of these players are pre-arbitration like Salty is, and are therefore cheap and will be around for another 4-5 years. Once we’ve filled a hole in the rotation or 1B or CF, we go out with the ~$25M we’ve just not spent on Teixeira’s arbitration and AJ and fill whatever other holes remain.

    It seems like a much better plan, not only for 2008, but for 2009-2011.

    My problem with the Teix deal has always been that, as good as it is for the next 50 games, it hurts Atlanta for every year after.

  27. Mraver,

    How does it hurt every year after and good morning everyone…

    Why I love Chip Carey…

    NL West Standings:
    Dodgers: 57 – 48
    Arizona: 58 – 49

    Chip: Ok, let me ask you this…are the Diamondbacks still in it?

  28. And there is easily a possiblity that with Andruw’s salary gone, we may be able to sign Tex after 2008.

  29. Don’t forget a lot can happen in a year and a half. To have a potential MVP candidate in your lineup paired w/ Chipper is always good.

  30. Over at Yahoo, they are saying that Hanson could be the pitcher instead of Harrison in the deal.
    Also, DOB is saying that Lillibridge could be the SS instead of Andrus.

    All this tells me that the writers have no clue, are hearing a bunch of names, and the final deal will be a surprise to most of them.

  31. Yeah, I think at this point everyone is just guessing at names after Salty. Hopefully this deal will be done today and all the speculation can stop.

  32. ‘And there is easily a possiblity that with Andruw’s salary gone, we may be able to sign Tex after 2008.’

    And Hampton’s for that matter.

  33. @42
    and Chipper is a FA after ’08. There is a lot of cash coming off the books soon.

  34. They will most likely try to clear Thorman through waivers, and reassign him to AAA.

  35. Listining to Joe and Chip is really amazing. They are convinced the offense is fine because they scored 14 runs, apparently ignoring the game Saturday where they struggled to get three runs off Doug Davis. And, yes, Chip’s line about the D’Backs having a chance when they were tied for first place is a classic Chipism. Also, Joe said that the Braves were looking at a sweep of the Cardinals after winning the first two games–only problem is, they didn’t win the first two games.

    I feel bad for Salty; he is in a very difficult position and if somehow this deal falls through, it will be an incredible let down for everyone. Salty will be in an almost untenable situation because the other players have made it clear how much they would like Teixera.

  36. I really don’t want to give up Hanson. While he probably won’t be anything (TNSTAAPP) he’s the one guy we have who might be an ace.

  37. I feel bad for Salty’s feelings, but what about my feelings?

    All those year when we couldn’t buy a hit in October? None of the Braves felt bad for me. My feelings are going to be hurt if we don’t pull this and another deal off.

  38. AAR-
    There is a $20 MM option for ’09. Guessing we won’t be picking that up.

  39. If we end up including Hanson, Mac, Matt Harrison will instantly become my least favorite player in professional sports.

  40. Why don’t we trade Andurw to the Rangers too. They are going to try and sign him in the winter anyways.

  41. What are the chances that all of our dreams come true and Chris Woodward is released when Tex gets here?

  42. I say we throw Woodward, Davies and Mike Vick in the deal to sweeten the pot. Would anybody miss them?

  43. I have a hard time believing JS would include Hanson in the deal.

    I’d love to see this list of pitchers everyone is referring to. It sounds like a nice sales tactic. What GM wouldn’t want a list of Atlanta Braves pitchers to choose from. Jon Daniels must feel really special.

    Window shopping is over. It’s time to buy.

  44. I just saw where we have an $11 M option on Renteria for 2009. If we decline the option, Boston picks up the $3 M buyout. (Braves really screwed Boston in that deal)

    I haven’t considered this when thinking about what we will do with Escobar. He’s going to be much cheaper that Renteria. Still, $11 M doesn’t strike me as that much considering the offense Renteria has provided, especially this year.

    Maybe it is though for a guy that doesn’t drive in alot of runs and has an inexpensive replacement waiting. The Braves may also decline this if they want to make a serious run at signing Tex (if if if we can get him).

  45. I think we can all agree that Renteria’s current production is well worth $11 M. The question is will his offense be worth $11 M in 2009. We’ll have to see what he does next year before we decide that.

  46. From Fox Sports:

    The Braves are on the verge of acquiring Rangers first baseman Mark Teixeira.

    The deal is done, pending a review of the medical records of the players involved, according to major-league sources.
    The Braves will receive Teixeira and left-handed reliever Ron Mahay.

    The Rangers will receive catcher Jarrod Saltalamacchia, Class A shortstop Elvis Andrus and two pitching prospects.

  47. The Braves are on the verge of acquiring Rangers first baseman Mark Teixeira.

    The deal is done, pending a review of the medical records of the players involved, according to major-league sources.
    The Braves will receive Teixeira and left-handed reliever Ron Mahay.

    The Rangers will receive catcher Jarrod Saltalamacchia, Class A shortstop Elvis Andrus and two pitching prospects. I wonder who the 2 pitching prospects are i hope were not giving up too much or whatever i cant wait till its a done deal. YEAH TEX!!

  48. I really want to know who those two pitchers are. They better not any of our really good ones seeing as we got Mahay, not Wilson.

  49. I bet it is to be named. They may wait and see how Harrison’s arm is and go from there.

  50. One of the pitchers is Harris, according to DOB. He’s finding out about the other one right now.

  51. “One of the pitchers is Harris, according to DOB. He’s finding out about the other one right now.”

    Who is Harris?

  52. So if the two pitching prospects are Harrison and Hanson, its a really bad deal. I hope we don’t give up either if it is Mahay and not Wilson. They can have Davies, though.

  53. YES! I’m glad this move was finally made. I expect to see nothing but optimism on this board, right?

    World Series, here we come!

  54. Hanson better not be included in the deal. I’m guessing Harrison and a throw in arm to protect the Rangers if he is badly injured. I don’t think the throw in pitcher would be someone of Hanson’s caliber. I am a little disappointed to see Elvis go, but Teixeira is a stud, no doubt.

  55. Not crazy about this. We had to throw in another pitcher just to get Mahay? Throw in the fact that we threw in our two highest-ceiling position prospects and my JS trust level just took something of a hit.

  56. Clearly, I love the phrase, “throw in”. Let’s not throw in the towel.

    Hate King, if you’re right, it’s more acceptable. Still, I’m bothered that we only got Mahay for all that.

  57. Anyone else having trouble getting onto DOB’s blog? It locks up IE each time I try.

  58. I have the same issue, JDMaker1.

    Better late than never, I say. Let’s put Tex’s gold glove at first and his bat in the lineup and make that push, guys!

  59. As long as Hanson is not included, I am ok with the deal. It’s not the best we want, but it’s tough when the cards are in the Rangers’ hands…

  60. I’m with you kc. We gave up a lot but I’m ok with it as long as Hanson is not included. If he is, my entire opinion changes.

  61. So we should expect to see Tex suited up for Tuesday? Just asking because I’m thinking of buying tickets now.

  62. hmm Start Salty well hopefully he starts in TExas so i can finally drop these crappy cacthers on my fantasy team and add him in. Good Luck Salty!!

  63. Yeah, DOB has been doing that to me all morning. Really frosts the balls.

    I agree with Zach, I’m ok so long as Hanson isn’t on board. Harrison doesn’t blow me away.

  64. http://sports.espn.go.com/mlb/news/story?id=2953424

    I wouldn’t mind picking him up for an extra bat bench–especially over Woodward. I am surprised the ‘Stros cut him.

    The deal for Tex appears to be done now–getting Mahay is better than nothing. But it does seem Daniels really got JS to crack.

    Still, I am not sold any of the prospects we are likely giving up are stars. The Braves got the only star in the deal, IHO, and a solid lefty reliever.

    You know what…good job, JS.

  65. Hopefully the last player is a low level relief pitcher. I don’t think JS would give up two of top pitching prospects.

  66. If the second pitcher is anyone I’ve ever heard of, I’m going to have a tough time completely getting behind the deal.

    With that said, I do look forward to seeing Teix in a Braves uniform.

  67. So JS cracked, eh? We got Mahay instead.

    Guess so. I guess JS is planning to retire soon as he seriously overpaid here. Bummer.

  68. Tex trade just in. Elvis Andrus and Salty.

    Just announced it on ESPN First Take. Another pitcher with Tex as well, but didn’t catch the name.

  69. yeah, elvis andrus didn’t look too good in the Futures game. Lillibridge looked bad as well.

  70. Yeah, I’ve been more critical of JS than anyone, and if this goes through, I have to give him credit. Still need a starter, but this is a step.

  71. The bottom line is Teixeira is the best player in the deal by far, no one the Braves gave up will be better than Tex. Picking up a left reliever was a plus too, although everyone would have preferred CJ Wilson. I give JS a B/B+ on this one, leaning more towards the B+.

  72. At least now I’ll be able to drive to Oklahoma Redhawks stadium to see Salty and in the future Elvis Andrus. Whats funny is I saw Mark Redman play for the Braves and then get released in Atlanta and then see him at home at Redhawks stadium and then get released here. Haha.

  73. I wouldn’t mind picking him up for an extra bat bench–especially over Woodward. I am surprised the ‘Stros cut him.

    Check his stat line and your surprise should disappear.

  74. Let me reiterate this:

    JS may have cracked a little, but for those with a major issue with the deal, the Braves got the best player in the trade, by leaps & bounds.

    Also, count me as a Braves fan who still feels this team can make a run and if you are even close, you ALWAYS ALWAYS try to compete and not give up.

    If the Braves miss the 2007 Playoffs, so be it, but I will stand up & applaud JS for doing right by the fans and aquiring a 27 year old stud first baseman that gives us a legit chance to string some wins together and climb back up the standings.

    Thank you, JS.

  75. I’m fighting back my man crush for Salty, but I could fall in love w/ Tex. :)

    I’m also in the camp about Hanson not being the 4th pitcher. I’m hoping it’s smitty’s barber. Frankly he has gotten me way too excited over the years with his rumors only to let me down every time.

  76. Robert-

    I see the stat line and at least Ensberg has a track record.

    Woodward’s track record is mediocrity his entire career.

  77. Ensberg would be a nice addition to the bench. Although I guess I would be a nice addition to the bench all things considered.

  78. If that’s what it takes to get Tex and Mahay, no wonder why nobody can get any trade done nowadays.

  79. Andrus wasn’t even in the Futures game, dude. He’s 18!!!

    I can’t decide whether I want Andrus to bust so this deal looks good in the long run, or whether I want him to be a star to teach people a lesson about the value of highly touted prospects. Probably the former.

  80. Actually I think most GM’s value prospects too highly. I think they need a lesson on how many busts are usually included in a deal full of prospects.

  81. Eh. I said I wasn’t too high on him in the first place. We’ll see how he is by the time the London Olympics roll around.

  82. I like this trade. The Braves dealt from a position of strength and gave up their backup catcher, a SS prospect who probably won’t be ready until 2010, a struggling and hurt pitching prospect in Matt Harrison and an unknown pitching prospect.

    As long as the remaining prospect ain’t Jo-Jo Reyes or Hanson, I’m great with this trade.

  83. I love this deal if it’s true. Very few pitching prospects become stars. I have no hesitation about giving up 2 of them who haven’t even made it to the major leagues yet. 4 prospects for 2 quality major league players who fill glaring needs for the major league team is a great deal. Will the Braves own rights to Mahay for next year?

  84. That is a good summatiom Dan. It’s easy to get enamored by the possibilities of Andrus, but it is not like we lack options at his position. Also, Harrison is not the same pitcher he was thought to be earlier in the season. All in all I am excited to see JS be aggresive.

  85. A related question–who goes to make roster room for Pena to be the backup catcher? I assume Woodward, Franco, or Thorman.

  86. Re Ensberg–I heard a report yesterday (can’t remember where, sorry) that he hurt a shoulder diving for a ball last year and hasn’t been the same since. Not sure if it’s true; just passing it along.

  87. I stand corrected on Elvis and the Futures game.

    And some GMs may overvalue prospects, but the people on here who keep citing the park-deflated stats of an 18 year-old playing against 21 year-olds are obviously on the other end of that spectrum.

  88. The ESPN article notes that only Ralph Kiner, Albert Pujols and Eddie Mathews have more home runs through their first four seasons that Tex.

    Putting it that way makes him sound like a pretty big BA.

  89. Yes, please send Woodward to the minors. Can we send him to the DSL Braves? LOL. Well if we’ve given up our top prospects, asides from Lillibridge, who’s our top prospects now?

  90. I also don’t quite understand the “Andrus wouldn’t even be able to contribute until 2010” sentiment. Will the Braves no longer have a need for good players by then?

  91. Anybody know a good Rangers blog? I’d like to see what Rangers fans think. I expect they are pleased.

  92. AAR – I just keep reloading DOB’s blog: http://www.ajc.com/blogs/content/shared-blogs/ajc/braves/entries/2007/07/28/if_tex_arrives.html

    His last post at 11:22: “It’s the 4-for-2 I said last night that it might become, and Braves are indeed getting Mahay, from what I’m told. Still waiting to confirm it with a Braves source, however. That’s coming from the other end.

    Braves give up Salty, Elvis and I believe Harris and another pitching prospect, but it’s not Jo-Jo. Get Tex and Mahay. But I should know for sure shortly.”

  93. 1. Who says that Andrus will have anything to contribute unless they can see into the future?

    2. I think we have a few more shortstops that can be playing by then.

  94. Mahay actually holds rightys to a lower BAA than lefties, but it’s funny, he’s only walked 5 lefthanded batters compared to 16 righthanded ones. Maybe the righties can hold off on the sweeping stuff better. Has anyone seen him pitch?

  95. Brandon Jones jumps to the top probably with Kala Ka’aihue taking a jump as well. Tommy Hanson better be the top pitching prospect because he better not be included in this deal.

  96. I saw Mahay pitch for the Cubs a few years ago and was thoroughly unimpressed. The fact that lefties have a higher BAA scares the crap out of me.

  97. Will the Braves no longer have a need for good players by then?

    With the ‘All In’ mentality the front office seems to be in, we will probably be deep into rebuilding by then.

  98. Well, .250 against lefties are not bad. Good K/BB ration against lefty as well. As I said, the entire Braves world would prefer Wilson, but the cards are not on JS’s hands. This is definitely a seller’s market.

  99. Even if Andrus becomes a star prospect in a few years, he’ll be blocked by either Escobar or Lillibridge anyway. I’m glad JS makes decisions based on what the team needs today rather than how players might develop in 3 or 4 years.

  100. Andy,

    He’s had that nickname since HS and it’s tattooed on his arm. I’d say it’s sticking with him.

  101. *thumps his head on the desk* Hasn’t anyone considered the fact taht highly touted prospects have blown up before, plus shortstop is actually a position of strength in this organization?

  102. He says one of the pitchers is Harrison. He likes the deal and is trying to come up with a nickname other than Salty.

    Rangers fans should love this deal, and should be pretty high on their GM as well. He played this about perfectly and got one of the better GMs in the game to basically let him pick out the best players from his farm system.

  103. Sam,

    No doubt. It’s about time the braves showed some balls at the trade deadline. It’s an exciting time.

  104. Clearly, Andrus can be dealt if he has to. We still have Escobar and Lillibridge at the top, and Lillibridge can probably play right now too.

  105. Man, I’ve used “clearly” a lot lately. I think that it’s best to pretend it doesn’t exist. ^_^;

  106. I wonder if the 2nd pitcher will be Devine. We already know Bobby doesn’t trust him. They even brought up Ascanio when Ledezma was released.

  107. I would love to see this lineup, however I know AJ will bat 5th in Cox lineup

    KJ/Tony Escobar
    Renteria
    C. Jones
    Tex
    McCann
    A. Jones
    Frenchy
    Diaz/Harris

    That impressive

  108. What a lineup!

    Man, I can’t wait to see the new 1B against Houston tomorrow night.

    So, who does JS get next? Surely Yunel Escobar is still being sent out for a starting pitcher, right?

  109. If that’s how much it costs to get Tex and Mahay, there is no way the braves can get another good starting pitcher from the trade market…unless you consider Carlos Silva to be good…

  110. I honestly do not want to see Yunel go anywhere. Who else can we rid of? I think we can get 2 pitching prospects from the Macon Music for Chris Woodward.

  111. I’ve expressed doubts about the deal (still holding my breath on the 2nd pitcher) but I have no beef about trading Andrus. Escobar and Lillibridge make Andrus expendable. I do wish the Braves had given Salty a longer look at first (especially because he’d be cheap for the next 5 years leaving more $$ available to spend on other positions) or had gotten a starter (or maybe Wilson) instead of Mahay. Good deal or not, the next two months will be fun to watch.

  112. The Cards are looking to move Anthony Reyes and will need some help at 2B/SS next year.

    Yunel Escobar and Kyle Davies for Anthony Reyes fills needs for both teams. Reyes is a lot better than his 2007 numbers indicate, and would help right away.

  113. I’d still like to see us take a chance on Ensberg. It’d be a gamble, a la Craig Wilson, but as someone said above, at least he has something of a track record. He was 4th in MVP voting in 2005, hit 30-something HR’s, and we could basically get him for nothing. He’s at least better than Woodward.

  114. kc: I agree – its no wonder more deals aren’t happening. I am happy with the trade (assuming Salty, Andrus, Harrison and Feliz) but I think we paid a little much. It would be better to have gotten Wilson instead of Mahay. But I’d rather overpay now than keep all of those prospects and hope next year works out better.

  115. Guys,

    Escobar and Lillibridge will not be blocking Andrus if he’s the player he’s expected to be. I understand the “trade from a position of strength/clogging” mentality; all I’m saying is I’d prefer to not trade the one with the highest ceiling—by far—in the clogged group.

    And we all have the same information. I’m fully aware of the existence of Yunel and Brent. There’s no need to continue to repeat the same unconvincing line re: the organization’s middle infield depth over and over. And I’m sorry, Sam, but no amount of banging your head on the desk is going to make everyone agree with your analysis. I get where you’re coming from and it just isn’t the best way of looking at the situation, IMO.

  116. So Jarrod Saltalamacchia, Elvis Andrus, Matt Harrison and Neftali Feliz for Mark Teixeira and Ron Mahay is the trade.

    Is Neftali Feliz anything special?

  117. #160 – Well that’s just the report from one Texas paper. And, that don’t even list Harrison in their article which seems to be agreed upon by everyone else.

    DOB said he still doesn’t know.

  118. I’m curious to see how Bobby is going to manage the roster. Assume that Salty’s spot goes to Pena as the backup catcher. This means two people have to go to make room for Tex and Mahay. Diaz and Escobar are safe. The only relievers that would make since are Asciano (who we are burning out of option fast) and Yates (who doesn’t deserve to be sent down, awful recent play aside). I’m going to be very disappointed if Woodward is in a Braves uniform come Wednesday, as Escobar or Harris can play every position he can minus first, which Thorman can do better. (Not to mention Aybar has to come back eventually, right?)

  119. He is like the first name I don’t want to be traded besides JoJo and Hanson…but oh well…

  120. Feliz is supposed to be damn good, but he is still in Danville…I guess I can stomach that…barely….

  121. Bill K. – Despite the number of times Ascanio is being sent up and down this year, it still only uses one option.

  122. I’ve seen both Reyes and Davies pitch enough times to be able to tell which is obviously the superior pitcher.

    Also, the career numbers back it up.

    http://sports.yahoo.com/mlb/players/7518

    Reyes has struggled some this year, but had a strong rookie season and has postseason experience. His minor-league track record was fantastic and his talent is still there. I’d take him in a heartbeat.

  123. Obviously, it is exciting to acquire Teixeira (I love how I can spell his name now without checking. the i’s were a b#$(* for awhile).

    I can live with who we’re giving up. BTW Andrus has .244 .330 .335 with 25 errors this year. Granted he’s young, but he hasn’t exactly been lighting it up.

    Harrison has actually been doing very well this year. However, everyone is right saying it probably won’t translate.

    Salty is a stud, but Teixeira is a bigger one.

    Here’s to Andruw not hitting 4th.

  124. Neftali Perez? I had never heard of him, but his numbers look absurd. Maybe another capellan type guy, hopefully. It does look like we gave up a lot. But Teixeira is a stud, and they are only prospects.

  125. Kyle has a great minor league record too. Anyway, it’s not going to happen. So, it’s not worth arguing…

  126. I’ve never heard of Feliz, but I’m not worried about trading anybody from Danville. Its the fact that it took 4 good prospects, incl. once who is MLB ready, that makes me feel like it was a little too much, rather than trading any one guy.

  127. I’d DL Yates and DFA Woodward, but I’m pretty confident that neither will happen.

    Maybe Thorman could be included in a Javy Vazquez package? :)

  128. Knowing Bobby Cox, his Tuesday lineup:

    Willy Harris, Edgar Renteria, Chipper Jones, Andruw Jones, Mark Teixeira, Brian McCann, Jeff Francoeur, Kelly Johnson and Chuck James.

    Watch in amazement as somehow, someway he keeps Andruw Jones in the four hole and makes Kelly Johnson bat eighth.

  129. Why would we go after Reyes? If he was any good the pitching poor Cardinals would try to move him?

    No way we are trading Escobar now…and Bobby likes him too much. He raves about him to anyone who will listen.

    So Stu and Unknown are the same people?

  130. A win-now trade. The Rangers got a boat load of talent and potential talent. This is similar to the bounty Andruw could have gotten the Braves last year before he became a 10 and 5 player.

    I think JS is definitely retiring. This is his last hoo-raw. Wow, it’s aggressive.

  131. Dan,

    Why is it so surprising that he would sandwich AJ in between two studs…especially against a righthander?

  132. I don’t feel we have overpaid. Salty should be good, everybody else are just prospects who haven’t done anything and who knows if they will. A great trade. When’s the last time we got somebody of Tex’s caliber?!

  133. Feliz has a high ceiling but even further from a sure thing than Andrus and we are loaded with pitching in Danville and the GCL. I’m happy.

  134. Agree with Timo…who cares what Salty and his fellow Braves going to Texas do…

    TEX is a legitimate star…and young. How the hell did Texas piss him off that badly…that they had to trade him.

  135. My summarized thoughts on this trade:

    I don’t hate our side of it—both immediately improve this year’s team, and if we are able to keep Teix past 2008, I’ll feel a lot better. Big if, of course.

    However, if I’m a Rangers fan, I’m absolutely ecstatic. It literally would be impossible to have gotten a better deal.

    The fact that the other side has such reason for excitement is, in my view, cause for concern.

  136. Well, I locked up my tickets for Tuesday night. Anybody else going? Want to have a Messiah Teixeira celebratory drink?

  137. “yeah, elvis andrus didn’t look too good in the Futures game. Lillibridge looked bad as well.

    Teixiera has looked really good in Major League Baseball games!

    Great

  138. Our lineup just got way better. Having 2 switch-hitting power guys is bad-ass. Let the batting-order debates begin.

    Now, for that other starting pitcher…

  139. Courtesy of Interleague play…

    Against Houston this year

    Tex is 4 of 14, 2 HR and 3RBIs…

  140. Agree with Dan on what tomorrow’s lineup will look like and also how absurd that is.

    Agree with sansho1 about us overpaying and still pulling hard for Teix.

    Agree with timo about the excitement of adding a player of this caliber.

  141. Pena has to be called up now, who does he replace? My guess is it has to be Woodward, I think Thorman helped himself a lot yesterday. no way he can clear waivers

  142. I assume that Franco will still start against left-handers, correct? We need that veteran presence in the line-up.

  143. “I assume that Franco will still start against left-handers, correct?”

    Thank God Teixeira is a switch hitter or Cox really might platoon him.

  144. Ascanio has to be sent down to make room for Mahay, so Woodward has to go for Pena right? Unless there is another trade in the works

  145. Thorman has to go, right? No way the team carries three 1B’s…and Woodward is the de facto 3rd 1B.

  146. I feel bad that Ascanio and Devine have been yanked up and down so much this year. And they’ve actually pitched good when they’re up. Can’t we use one of them to replace Yates? Please!

  147. I know we dont need that many 1B, but for some reason I dont want to just give Thorman away. Woodward is useless anyways

  148. Wow. This deal kinda sucks, especially if the other arm we give up is a decent one. Salty, Andrus, Harrison + another and we can’t even get their young lefty? Yeesh.

  149. I think the Braves know Thorman is decent enough to garner some interest, but he has had enough time to prove he is not a full time 1B, at least not yet. Too many holes in that long swing, and his defense is good but not top shelf.

    I guess they will have to see if he clears waivers and will report back to Richmond. However, someone may claim him, though I imagine just about every organization has a bulky 1B in their system.

  150. Mraver, I know what you’re saying, and I’d say that it only potentially sucks. We’re giving up some really young guys who, odds are, will never pan out for two players who will REALLY help this year, including one of the premier young sluggers in the game.

  151. Thorman can play average first with flashes of better and average outfield. Woodward can play an abysmal third, an unprepared first, or middle infield. Thorman, unlike Woodward, crushes the ball when his caveman swing actually makes contact…which is really at the same rate Woodward’s does. I know which choice I’d make…

  152. “The sides reached a compromise agreement after Texas sought a substitute for pitching prospect Matt Harrison due to injury concerns. According to the Fort Wort Star-Telegram, the Braves have agreed to send pitching prospect Nestali Feliz and a player to be named later instead of Harrison.”

    CNNSI.COM

  153. If you count Harris as a backup infielder, that means he’s starting 2/3 of the time at one position (LF) and backing up at least two others (CF, 2B), as well as, I guess, being an emergency 3B. That strikes me as stretching pretty thin to keep three guys who can only play 1B.

    Of course, the problem then is you’d have to outright Thor, which would expose him to other teams for no compensation, which essentially means we’re giving up five players now.

  154. Just FYI — BP had Feliz as the Braves #3 prospect. He also made their top 100 list.

    I knew we were likely to overpay for Teixeria, but I’m really disappointed in the fact that we couldn’t get a better arm than Mahay. Especially considering what we gave up. Oy.

  155. I’m so geeked! This is a McGriff like trade. I don’t think Salty was going to pan out anyways.

  156. 223 – Interesting that cnnsi.com would say that since the Fort Worth Telegram didn’t say anything about sending Feliz “instead” of Harrison. It just said that Feliz was one of the prospects.

  157. Stu,

    I will be in October when Smoltz, Tex, and Chipper hold up that little gold trophies with all the other teams flags on it!!!!!!!!!!!!

    Let’s start the chop!

    OOOOOOOOOOOOOOHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHH OOOOOOOOOOOOOOOHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHH OOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHH!

  158. Steven A. and Skip Bayless are currently imparting us with their wisdom on First Take on ESPN 2.

  159. My Lineup
    KJ
    Renteria
    Chipper
    Teixiera
    McCann
    Andruw
    Francoeur
    Willie/ Diaz

    The Real Lineup
    Willie
    Renteria
    Chipper
    Andruw
    Teixiera
    McCann
    Francoeur
    Escobar/ KJ

  160. Re a move involving Davies and Thorman–I bet that trade will bring a lot in return.

    Re listening to Screamin A Smith–no thanks.

  161. I like Escobar a lot, but as of right now I think Kelly Johnson is a better overall hitter.

  162. Tex over the last 3 years…

    2003: 38/112rbi/.370ob/.560slg/ .281BA
    2004: 43/144 /.379ob/.575 / .301
    2005: 33/110 /.371ob/.514 / .282

    Quit complaining and be thankful we have a legitimate superstar at 1st base.

    Do you know who JS gave up to get Fred McGriff? Melvin Nieves…remember him?

    We can still get a lefty out there…believe me.

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