I want to propose that Braves Journal campaign to retire Andruw’s #25.
I don’t need to explain why this is a worthy cause. Just look at the (completely scientific!) poll results on your right. Or Andruw’s phenomenal career with the Braves. Or spend some time watching YouTube highlights. This is a no-brainer if there ever was one, and I know you all don’t need any persuading on that point.
Every campaign needs a clear goal, which tells us who is going to do what by when. Our goal would be for the Braves to commit to taking this action by the end of this baseball season. They would ideally agree to retire his number in 2019.
In order to accomplish our goal, we need a strategy, a theory for why the decision-maker’s interests will come into alignment with ours.
Sometimes in politics, the decision-maker is with you on the issue but the public or key constituencies aren’t, so you need to create some political cover for the decision-maker to do the right thing that she or he wants to do. A lot of times, the decision-maker is not with you, but the public is. I’d argue that this is where the Braves front office is. With no better way to judge the situation right now, we can surmise that the relationship between Andruw and the Braves remains strained, so they inducted him into the Braves HOF but didn’t do the full honors.
Anyhow, my theory is: the Braves are susceptible right now to pressure from fans. The organization has yet to truly deliver on a rebuild that has left core fans antsy and demoralized, there is still plenty of ill will around everything Sun Trust Park-related, and the Coppolella scandal has tarnished the image of the franchise and eroded trust in the Braves’ top leadership.
If we can create an atmosphere where the Braves front office can step and be the hero* that does the right thing for Andruw/Braves fans/baseball in general, I believe they will happily take the bait. This should be a relatively easy ask if we can set it up like there’s a groundswell of public support for Andruw
I also think that signing onto this effort is an exceptionally easy ask to make of Braves fans. Like us, they shouldn’t need persuading. He’s in our HOF, and…it’s Andruw, enough said. If we come up with a few clever ideas to execute the strategy, it’s not hard to see the thing taking off.
Adding to Timo’s post that got JC’ed from the last thread:
It is really weird how the Braves won’t retire his number or don’t have plans too. He must have really mailed in his career in their eyes. He is certainly getting a different treatment than other legends. And he’s a legend, no other way about it.
He lived in a strip club and battered his wife. Maybe that’s enough for some.
Chipper had an illegitimate son, Bobby also battered his wife, and Mad Dog would light players’ shoes on fire. Ok, the last one is not that bad. But I doubt those two reasons you cite were what has done Andruw in. It has to be something more related to his on-field performance or off-the-field preparation.
We should write Peanut and DOB first. That way we will get the State Run Media answer as to why it hasn’t happened.
mad dog would also do unspeakable things to the clubhouse chili and pee on people in the shower….shudder
Hunter Renfroe anyone?
If Chipper glows about Camargo, and then Camargo’s BABIP dips and he becomes a .250/.300/.350 guy, then does that hurt Chipper’s reputation?
Renfroe would be an improvement over Markakis, no doubt, and would probably cost our 7th-best starting pitcher. I’d hope a few million in negative equity on Kakes doesn’t keep us from a deal like that.
I’m in on a Retire 25 campaign for sure.
@ 8 No.
@ 7, 9: The price would be higher but if we’re going to eat Neck’s salary I’d rather get Corey Dickerson.
The Eternal City, Rome
where gopher balls return to home
strike outs, two a penny
who will break out? the answer, possibly not many.
pick up your phones
write some op eds
embarrass the Front Office heads.
They really need to come up with/release guidelines for who qualifies for number retirement and who doesn’t. That will at least force them to outline why Dale Murphy gets up there despite not being in the Hall of Fame and Andruw doesn’t, for instance. If the answer is Murphy winning two MVPs while Andruw won none, that’s fine, but then at least they have to think through the implications of that while putting these guidelines together. (Terry Pendleton won an MVP. Should he be up there? If Andruw had won the MVP the year he hit 50 home runs, would we have put him up there then?, etc.) Without concrete guidelines, though, it can continue to be shrouded in mystery and they can continue to do whatever they feel like.
Well, Murphy belongs up there, no doubt. The guy was the best or second best player in baseball for 3-4 years.
Unsubscribe on Renfroe. His walk rates are horrible, his K rates are horrible, and he doesn’t appear to be an asset defensively. All he has is power. Sound like anyone we just got rid of?
Perhaps he gets better, but the guy is already 26, so it’s not like he’s overly young.
I’d take him if they’re giving him away, but that’s about it
I saw Hunter Renfroe, and as a Clemson fan I thought it was a mis-spelling, of this guy:
Didn’t even realize there was a less famous Hunter Renfrow/Renfroe out there…count me in on the “pass” group for Renfroe. FWIW, he is coming into his “prime” age-26 season (or – what Ethan just said)
I’m pretty sure the reason Andruw’s number has not been retired is he signed with the Dodgers.
It seems to me that number retirement for the Braves is reserved for their pantheon level players, and Andruw just didn’t quite reach that level. Nothing more than that.
Andruw is pantheon. You can argue that he’s on the borderline for MLB HOF level, but he’s absolutely pantheon for the franchise. He’s not David Justice.
Jones WAR 62.8 I’d half his dWAR contribution leaving a NocahomaWAR of 51.
Justice WAR of 40.5. I’d half his dWAR contribution leaving a NocahomaWAR of 34.
I realize that WAR is not oWAR+dWAR, btw…
Justice OPS+ is 129
Jones OPS+ is 111
Justice career .280 BA
Jones career .254
In MOST cases, I’d say that Justice was closer than you’d think but YES Andruw’s defense was generational so its not as close as I think the offensive disparity would lead you to believe.
Jones has 1 HOF comparable(Duke Snider) and Justice has 1 as well (Doby).
Jones> Justice but not by a mile.
Andruw was so good in CF that I would have rooted for him if he’d played for the Mets.
Retire his number.
Andruw’s offensive contributions don’t rise to pantheon levels, so the cornerstone of his case is defense. While a SS or 3B might have enough additional defensive value compared to their peers to put them over the top, its hard (IMO) for an outfielder to do the same. Also, it’s not all about stats. There is an emotional component that is a factor, and there is a difference between being appreciated and being loved. Reasonable people can disagree, and I would have no objection whatsoever if the Braves retired his number. I just don’t find it surprising that it hasn’t happened.
With the Rays trading Souza, Baby Rock will finally have his opportunity. That outfield, though, is now Mallex, Span, and Kiermaier. And we thought an April ‘17 outfield of Jace, Ender, and Kakes was bad.
Gant’s delivery is no more:
DoB has an article up about Albies. In the article Ozzie both bashes his doubters and silences his skeptics. A double silencing of critics is extremely rare. You can go ahead and pencil hI’m in for the all star game after those endorsements.
“We all have this need to come back to our convictions. There’s a quiet calm in doing so, after weary hours and the world on our backs, it is as much comforting as it is pleasant to look back and think that everything we knew was right. Basking in the glow of our singular beliefs, we rummage around in the memory of our day, for little bits, some pieces of proof to acknowledge that we were right all along. We hold these fragments close to our heart, till it is all our heart knows. And what our heart knows is what our eyes see, and what our brains remember. Our lives are but a cycle of memories rehashed for satiety.”
So what do you make of that? It comes from this morning’s Guardian, a reader’s comment on a game just ended where a piece of Messi magic denied Chelsea victory. It purports to summate and describe the sporting life as lived by us non participants who can get little of it out of our minds. It could as well have Andruw at its core as Lionel. It is over the top of course and so are we.
Its first and last sentences, if original, are brilliant- the sum total of a sporting life on the sidelines. Would be most interested to hear how it went down with you. Guff? We, unraveled?
for this relief see our nutter smiles
to be named after your best pitch
is either brilliant or silly, we can’t decide which.
‘brilliant’ should be ‘prescient’, much better and in @25 i wanted to put the opening para in italic. Adam is good at that. When the 5 minutes are up i feel trapped sometimes. Help, please but keep it simple, the red cell count is down.
timo…my question of you the other day to ask the source of your $119 MLBtv deal was JC’d. Thanks if you can.
Rays got Carlos Gomez on 1 year @ 4 million.
Brian McCann’s feelings aside, one could make the argument the Braves could use a righthanded bat who can play all 3 outfield spots with some power…and I doubt it’ll come out he’s had a special long-term affinity for the Tampa Bay/Rays.