I didn’t talk about Jayson “Extra Y” Stark’s thing because as I’ve mentioned Stark (along with Mark “Peanut” Bowman and everybody who attempts to cover baseball for Sports Illustrated) is on my “ignore” list but also because I figured JC would handle it. And he has, better than I would. Go read.
Today’s game thread video is dedicated to Chris Woodward and Martin Prado.
anyone hope Clemmons gets blown up in his 1st start
Excellent write up. I knew Stark was full of it.
csg-
EVERYONE should root against Roger Clemens. It’s only slightly less fun then gleefully rooting against Barry Bonds at all costs.
And MAC…you really hate and cannot handle anyone disagreeing with you.
More then a few of us wholeheartedly agree with Jayson Stark on Andruw being wildly overrated.
He’s 100% on the mark, whether you care to admit it or not. Mr. potbelly, no hustle, never-runs-hard-tofirst-to-save-hisfreaking-life Andruw Jones, is overrated on a lot of people’s eyes.
I have to agree a little with Stark. If you read the article carefully he is saying that Andruw is not in the same class as Mays, Mantle, Griffey or Cobb. Like JC says I don’t get the reference to Kirby Puckett but whatever.
However some folks do see Andruw as being a Pujols, Alex Rodriguez type of complete player. If you do then you have overrated Andruw.
At best and JC summarizes this very well, Andruw is a championship caliber player. A very important piece of a successful franchise run. He gets a lot of props for playing what Stark describes as the glamour position in baseball.
Now mind you overrated is different from sucking. I’m no fan of Jayson Stark but I think that the jist of the article is essentially correct. He isn’t saying that Andruw Jones sucks but that he isn’t a super star either.
But no matter what Jayson Stark says, someone will pay a king’s ransom for Andruw’s services this fall.
Thanks for the spiel, JC, well-done.
The notion of “overrated” is always going to be subjective. Someone here once said that Derek Jeter is overrated, as if that made a damn bit of difference to the Yankees’ success.
To me, if a guy contributes to victories, that’s all I care about. How he rates vs. Aaron Rowand or Johnny Damon doesn’t impact my evaluation of him.
I understand that it can be fun for fans and useful at contract time for agents, but all Andruw has ever done is help us win. There’s nobody I would’ve rather had out there than him.
Alex, you’re absolutely entitled to your opinion on Andruw. But I stand by Mac’s assertion that Jayson Stark is an idiot. I think it’s very possible to show that Andruw has lost a step defensively and has not matured offensively in the way we would have liked.
In other words, it’s definitely possible to make a GOOD argument that Andruw’s overrated, and you’ve done so very persuasively over the years. (Though I don’t think you’ve ever called him the “most overrated centerfielder of all time,” which sounds impossibly harsh to me.) But Jayson Stark made a dumb argument about why Andruw’s overrated, which JC did a good job of refuting.
It’s not that Andruw isn’t overrated — he probably is, as a hitter. But Stark’s argument is that Andruw is rated with the best players of all time (he isn’t) and that Andruw isn’t a great defensive outfielder (he is). And he’s a far greater all-around player than Johnny Freaking Damon, even if you leave aside that he, unlike JFD, rarely leaves the lineup.
The most-similar hitters to Andruw through age 30 are Frank Robinson, Eddie Matthews, and Johnny Bench. The most-similar to JFD through age 32 are Cesar Cedeno, Ben Chapman, and Willie Davis.
Stark’s argument is like… I dunno. Saying that Brad Pitt is overrated because he’s not as good of an actor as DeNiro or Brando and also not very good looking.
makes sense, so long as plate discipline is akin to dramatic acting.
I basically agree with JC’s analysis of Andruw. He is a great centerfielder (whether or not he is as good now as several years ago is another issue)and a good but not great hitter. I think he is overrated to the extent that he is considered a great player,which he is not, as opposed to a great outfielder. But, then, neither was Brooks Robinson. Anyone that thinks Andruw is overrated asn outfielder should have seen the catch yesterday. As Ububba says, whether he is overrated according to some standard is irrelevant; the question is whether the Braves are better with him in centerfield than without and obviously they are. But I find him enormously frustrating (as I think most do) because of his offensive inconsistency and, overall, I think Chipper is a better player (when he plays).
woodward has made a career out of acting like a baseball player..it just hasn’t been a great performance.
Good post Mac – puts a good perspective on everything. No Andruw isn’t in the same class as those players, but I don’t think anybody tried to put him in that class. And I agree – what was Puckett doing in that conversation?
I like the Andruw/Brooks Robinson comparison, actually.
Puckett benefits from JFK syndrome–having your career dramatically cut short highlights your virtues and obscures your faults in people’s memories. I think Puckett also benefits from a certain reverse stereotyping. Nobody looking at his body type expected to see a fleet-footed center fielder, so he looked faster than he was.
No serious baseball person (but then, we are talking about Jason Stark aren’t we?) would place Puckett in the pantheon of center fielders because he simply didn’t play long enough to deserve to be there.
I enjoyed JC’s article on Andruw. Stark got called out for not correctly researching Andruw Jones the player, not the myth. He uses old statistics that fit his argument while he ignores more accurate statistics that point to Andruw being an excellent defensive player, and perhaps, an overrated offensive player. Andruw has been great throughout his career and I enjoyed watching him play centerfield for the Braves.
I think the Andruw weight issues have made it easy for people to peg him as overrated. Why aren’t people acknowledging his ability to stay healthy while he constantly dives around the outfield and never asks for a day off? Andruw’s ability to stay healthy, and position his body on diving catches to avoid injury, is, if anything, underrated.
Watchman, I agree with you that Puckett shouldn’t be in the pantheon of center fielders. But DiMag didn’t play for all that long either–just 13 seasons–and he’s absolutely in the pantheon, even though a lot of that is just Yankee bias.
I’m sensing an ORR siting at third tonight.
There’s no Yankee bias in saying DiMaggio was one of the greatest. It’s indisputable. He lost 3 years to war service, which you can’t really count against him.
And ages 28 – 30, commonly referred to as your “prime” I think, to boot.
Yeah, WW2 took some prime years away from Greenberg, DiMaggio, Williams & Feller.
But something a little more important came up, so what can you do?
Over/underrated is sportswriter code for “I couldn’t come up with an actual idea for a column this week”. The whole idea of under/overrated is ridiculous since it’s based on your perception of what other people are thinking – a very inexact measurement to be sure.
Andruw will wind up as a Top 10 all time centerfielder, have been a key contributor on a large number of winning teams, and had some October moments to remember. That’s really about all you can ask for out of a career. Of course that won’t stop lunatics like Alex R. from knocking him for not turning into Willie Mays.
Shea Hillenbrand Expendable
It’s an understatement to say that Angels’ DH Shea Hillenbrand is an expendable player. He’s hitting .236/.250/.311 in 148 ABs, the third-worst hitting performance in baseball according to VORP.
lets dont get any crazy ideas here, JS!
FWIW, with the immortal Oliver Perez on the mound tonight at Shea vs. San Fran, Barroid will be out of the lineup.
Yes, Robert, but Jayyyyson wrote an entire book on the subject. Maybe that’s how ESPN writers get tenure or something.
I disagree with Watchman about the JFK effect with regard to Puckett because it suggests that people didn’t think of Puckett as a great player until he retired. I think he was already immensely popular and considered–perhaps incorrectly–as a truly great player because of a few moments, ie, against the Braves in 1991. He was the kind of player that people liked and remembered. I think people pretty much discounted his flaws when he was playing.
Puckett is overrated (I can’t think of any other way to put it) because of the emphasis put on batting average, and because he was well-liked. In fact, his comparable players aren’t nearly as good as Andruw’s. Through age 35 (his last season) none of his top six comps are in the Hall of Fame, though Dave Parker will probably make it in eventually and Bernie Williams will be an interesting case. Four of Andruw’s top six are, plus Junior Griffey.
I’ll do a “where does he rank” post on Andruw during an off-day. I’d say about 15th-20th all time if he doesn’t do anything else of note. He’s already accomplished almost as much as Murph did.
I’ve tremendously enjoyed watching Andruw over the years, and while he’s never developed into the hitter I hoped he would become, I think as ububba so eloquently said,
“There’s nobody I would’ve rather had out there than him.”
And for me, that includes Puckett. Watching Andruw, day in and day out, patrolling center field was wonderful, and I’ll miss him when he’s gone. He’s the most graceful center fielder I’ve ever seen, although Amos Otis comes close, and he just makes everything look so easy, that I thinks its probably a little easier to say he’s overrated.
Hey, Robert, let’s not get personal–none of us here are lunatics, unless completely fanatically rooting the Braves makes you crazy.
I’ll never say that Puckett wasn’t damn-good. His popularity & post-season heroics put him over the top with HOF voters. Still, I can’t take anything away from him.
Hall of Fame? He’s borderline for sure, but OK, I’ll give it to him. The guy hit .318 for 12 full seasons. Plus, I’m a big post-season guy—I actually expect “great players” to play well in the post-season—and Kirby’s PS numbers (24 games) are better than his regular-season numbers.
But compare his numbers with Mattingly. You may be surprised what you find.
Alex R. and I have been having this conversation for ten years, so I don’t think it’s going to be settled any time soon. But don’t call him a lunatic, please.
I’ll admit that can be a bit of a lunatic—but only when I drink vodka. So I tend to stick to beer.
A wise decision by all accounts, Ububba. What’s your favorite beer? I really like Three Philosophers (9% alc by volume, dark, full-bodied, and rich), but I’m also a big fan of Brooklyn Brown Ale.
JFK was an assassinated president. Can we stop with the poorly placed metaphors. That’s reaching a bit.
That’s like saying Roberto Clemente suffered from Buddy Holly syndrome or something. Or Magic Johnson suffered from Abraham Lincoln-ness. Kirby Puckett would be William McKinley is these regards.
Spending time arguing who is or is not overrated is redundant. As Braves fans, we have suffered the right to place blame and commend Andruw. The bottom line is, Stark wrote a well-researched, but opinionated book. He could have researched the statistics for any player, he chose Andruw.
I’m glad Andruw has been a Brave. He got over the mistakes of his youth by not hustling in the outfield (I appreciated his play more after watching Manny play). I guess I just feel that he really loves the game of baseball. I accepted long ago that he’s not an average hitter, he’s a long baller. It’s his role. I feel honored I’ve watched him play center for ten years, as he will be a lock for the hall of fame before he turns 35.
Unless, you know. JFK.
I enjoyed JC’s take. I had read Stark’s article already, so his (JC’s) argument made a pretty compelling counterpoint.
Having said that, it is interesting how perception (in this case, my perception of AJ in the field) is shaped by your opinion. I went to two of the weekend games (Fri & Sun), and there were about 5 balls that dropped for hits over the course of the two games where I thought “man, a couple years ago, Andruw would have had those for sure”. They landed just far enough away from him where if he had an extra step or two he would have been able to get them.
Then he had the incredible catch taking the homer away from what’s-his-name (Phillies 3b).
Bottom line – I have no idea from watching the games if he actually has lost steps, but my opinion on the matter was influenced by what I had read. And JC’s article makes a strong argument (stronger than Stark’s, in my opinion) that AJ is still up there with the best defensive CFs in the game.
But I like reading Stark (unlike a lot of others). And I love seeing the Alex R passionate comments…
AAR,
My favorite beers? Such an unfair question, but gun to my head? Last beer on earth? I’ll take a Guinness pint poured in Dublin. The thought makes me want to weep.
The only American beer I genuinely love is Anchor Steam. I dig the Belgian stuff, but (Georgia boy that I am) I also like a cold, sloppy lager. So in a pinch, I have no problem with any number of “low-brow” entries—Fosters, Harp, etc.
Love German brews, too. There’s a German place I go that has kick-ass Hefeweizen.
And here’s a weird one: La Fin du Monde from Canada. High-octane & tasty.
I tend to lean in the direction of the Ben Franklin quote: “Beer is proof that God loves us and wants us to prosper.”
And wouldn’t you know it: Tonight I’m headed to the Heartland Brewery near Wall Street. Dang, I’m thirsty…
First updates in on NL All-Star voting:
http://mlb.mlb.com/news/article.jsp?ymd=20070528&content_id=1990778&vkey=news_mlb&fext=.jsp&c_id=mlb#ballotResults
McCann and Chipper are second at their positions, Renteria 5th among shortstops, Andruw 5th and Frenchy 10th among outfielders.
I have to say that Jerry Buss getting arrested for DUI with a 23 year old woman in the car was an unexpected twist in the latest Lakers soap opera. Maybe we will find out it was her idea to trade Shaq.
And I don’t mean to alarm anyone but Pete Orr is in the starting lineup. It would seem that Bobby has already had enough of Prado.
Lineups:
Braves:
Johnson 2b
Harris lf
Renteria ss
McCann c
AJones cf
Francoeur rf
Thorman 1b
Orr 3b/ out
Smoltz p
Brew Crew:
Weeks 2b
Hardy ss
Braun 3b
Fielder 1b
Estrada c
Jenkins lf
Hall cf
Hart rf
Sheets p
I really want someone to get dropped and have Pena come back to back up McCann. Salty wont play until we have someone to back him up. Pena hits better and would be more useful off the bench.
Ububba, if you like lagers try Yuengling and Tiger.
Mets down 2-0 after one. Perez has given up two solos. hopefully, their SP will come back to earth
oh yeah, the yanks are losing also
more news, sorry
Clemmons to start Monday against the ChiSox
I’m bored, however, the Phils are losing 5-0 in the 2nd
Remember Jayson Stark hails from Filthadelphia(as do I) so to say he is a little bias against opponents of the home team wouldn’t be a far stretch. I pay no attention to anybody on ESPN.
I haven’t said much about this Andruw thing…but this is the best way I can put it.
Andruw is my country mate, and I’m very proud of his accomplishments. We live on a small island, and almost no one here makes it big in sports.
We’ve had a handful of good athletes, but none bigger than Andruw. He is an icon down here, and all of us can only smile when he makes one of his patented catches in center.
I was a Braves fan before Andruw got there…and I will be a Braves fan after he leaves, but in the meantime, it’s been a pleasure to watch him play and grow into a Hall of Famer.
Is he underrated..is he overrated…I can’t say. I’m not a Sabermetrician and I won’t pretend to be one.
He is our starting center fielder and a damn good one in my opinion.
Does he take ugly swings…most definately. Do his slumps work on my nerves…of course.
But I’ll still take his D in center over any other center fielder in the game, and I have a feeling that our pitchers will agree with me.
Willie’s still sizzlin’
It would appear that the ball is carrying tonight.
Yeah baby!
WILLIE! WILLIE! WILLIE!
WILLIE MAYS HAYES!
I deem this to be a good start.
BIG WILLIEEEEEE
Free Willy!
what a start
When I think of Willie’s chances of hitting home runs, I am clearly reminded of Rafael Belliard
well this is a start you wont see often against Sheets
Overrated, my…
WTG Druw…
Hey Jayson:
Overrate *this*.
Also, Jayson Stark is a profoundly ugly man.
Frenchy just swung at one ugly curveball…
I think I am going to start the Joe Simpson Drinking Game, though I don’t personally drink. Whenever he talks about going the other way, drink. You’ll be wasted by the sixth.
Haha I have definitely noticed that lately. I have to admit though, I like him and Jon Sciambi as a unit.
I’m going to start, and later in life blame my alcoholism on Joe Simpson.
By later in life, I mean the 6th inning.
To address Robert from earlier:
I really don’t care what you think. I am an original BravesJournal and have posted enough insightful commentary on here and have also admitted openly when I was wrong (see: Adam laRoche last year) that it doesn’t bother me that someone who doesn’t know me calls me a lunatic. Mac, AAR and a few others have met me in person so those are the opinions that count. I am actually a nice person if you don’t call me a lunatic 😉
Ok, that aside, this series is showing me that maybe we should just play the NL Central the rest of the year. Might help our record.
Now the AL central…that won’t be pretty.
We need to start a new Joe Simpson drinking game about Smoltz’ effective slider.
Wow..it’s been a while since we had a drinking game Mac…
This was the second one we had.
If anyone is up for it…I can make version 3.
The Chip Caray drinking game: (Version 1)
1.) Anytime Chip mentions a team other than the Braves, take a drink.
2.) Be Drunk.
(Rule 1A.) If Chip mentions the Cubs, take two drinks.
The Chip Caray drinking game: (Version 2)
1.) Take a drink after any of the following phrases: SWUNG ON and BELTED, FISTED to the RIGHT SIDE, GETS HIS MAN, Wrigley, SHOOTIN’ FOR THE DOWNS
2.) Be Drunk
Smoltz just carved up Braun. He missed that slider by 8 inches.
Ok, ok.
I was just joking around, but this blown coverage drinking game is extensive. I am impressed. Did you use algorithms or something?
I go to Ohio University, so this will come in handy.
Prince Fielder scares me. Actually, nearly all the first basemen in the National League scare me, though Thorman for different reasons than the others.
Thorman is actually Dr. Bruce Banner.
Here is Part 1 Kyle..
I did my best one those.
I’m taking more suggestions for the drinking game, though maybe Davey should host it. And I put in another call in tomorrow’s game thread.
If you were to say something along the lines of, “Everytime Bob Wickman wipes his forehead grease on a new baseball…” you’d have alcohol poisoning. So are we going for realism? Baseball games usually last three hours, I suppose.
A Matt Diaz/Frenchy first pitch rule has to be included. That’s all I request. Oh, and maybe something about how if a Braves player is done for a calandar year…
Last year we had plenty of ammo for drinking games…. Every night inspired me plenty.
I guess I can make part 3 now. The back-end of our rotation is bad enough, and PraWoodOrr also inspire us plenty to consult Jack Daniels…
Suggestions:
If Pete Orr is in the starting lineup, take a drink.
If Woodward is in the lineup, take a drink. Two if playing anywhere but short, three if playing first base.
(Two extra drinks if either bats higher than 8th.)
If Chad Paronto is in the game, drink. Three drinks if he does NOT allow a run. Three if he doesn’t record an out.
If Cox leaves a starter in one inning too long, take one drink per inning played.
If Wickman gets them 1-2-3 in the 9th, take a drink.
If Moylan pitches a scoreless inning, drink and then sing a verse of “Waltzing Matilda.”
If anyone but Smoltz, Hudson, or James pitches a scoreless inning, take a drink each the shutout lasts.
Last June could have put any Braves fan in a coma.
Every time a player hits his ninth homer of the year, drink in honor of Joe Simpson’s nine career homers.
Alrighty….
When part 3 is done, I’ll put up the link. 😀
(yes, I’m comfortable enough with myself to use the word ‘Alrighty’.)
I love when Chip asks Joe to explain the finer points of hitting for the kids at home.
Oops- that last should be for any starter other than those three.
If the Superman theme plays after Andruw does what he’s “overrated” for, take a drink.
If Frenchy has an at bat of six pitches or more, take a drink. Two if he walks.
I think I like Skip because of the sarcasm involved when he talks about the movie coming up on TBS. Skip’s past caring about the accountability of his words.
For a good seven years in the mid-90s, I remember it being Judge Dredd for some reason.
Probably because it generally was Judge Dredd.
Seems about right.
That or Demolition Man.
Thor!
On a baseball related note, since I can only watch gameday, any updates on Chipper?
Also, I feel dumb asking this because I watch baseball a lot, but what’s the “retroactive DL” DOB talks about in his latest column? What does it mean for Chipper and the Braves?
I am with Kyle…nothing better then Skip Caray. Thank God I have XM so I at least occassionally get the man.
What I wouldn’t give for an assault team to ambush the Braves booth, take Chip away in chains, and put Skip back on all TV broadcasts where the man deserves to be.
Well, that’s not good.
I bet he wears his sunglasses at night
I thought it was too obvious.
Retroactive DL means he goes on effective the first day he missed. Therefore, if it’s retroactive to five days ago, he’d only have to miss ten days.
Thanks Mac –
SNL video on one hit wonders testifying against Napster, with Will Ferrel as Corey Hart: http://youtube.com/watch?v=VVpQeUWEDlY
“Never Surrender” is more apt for the way he legged out his two hits yesterday.
3 to 1 Braves after two. Sheets with 42 pitches, Smoltz with 33.
2-for-2. Maybe Andruw’s snapping out of his slump.
Overrated stolen base.
a steal?…for AJ?
“I am an original BravesJournal and have posted enough insightful commentary on here…”
Nothing personal, but citing one’s message board tenure is one of the lamest moves on earth, which is remarkable considering the relative newness of the internet. We can all rattle off opinions of current, past, future Braves whether Robert, Mac or our respective dogs care for us. I say we ignore any personal jabs and avoid this nonsence.
By the way, the pregame banter involved homerless streaks, Willie was second only to Woodward. Maybe Orr has now slid up a spot and will be inspired. Its a good week for the little bats, I won $40 in a game of pass-the-cup at wrigley on monday thanks to a Reggie Abercrombie blast.
Ugh…
Just a heads up, the Brewers broadcast has no commercials between innings and Bob Ueker.
Gameday doesn’t give a good feel for the game…
Anyone watching: Smoltz has good numbers, 30 strikes to 11 balls…but are his pitches getting too much of the plate tonight? Lucky hits? Long night ahead?
Skip Caray deserves to be on radio because he is one of the very few that can do it right anymore.
Uecker after the homerun : “When he hits them, they stay hit”
Whatever that meant.
Seriously, Howard is frightening, but Cecil’s kid is like a force of nature.
Estrada runs as fast as a crippled elephant.
Kyle B,
+1 Hahahaha
That was awesome Kyle.
[2nd attempt]
Kyle B,
+1 Hahahaha
I’m watching two games(SFG VS NYM)at once. He is not a Brave though. Rookie Lincecum…excites curiosity but his pitching motion is hmmm…well….interesting!
Maybe today Smoltzie is not his day. C’mmmmmmooooon.
I haven’t been able to follow the Braves as closely as I would like lately. What’s the story on Chipper Jones? When do we expect him back in the lineup?
Mets and Giants tied at 3 in the bottom of the 8th.
Oh pfart, Smoltzie leaving.
Oh fuck.
[3rd attempt]
Kyle B(#107),
+1 Hahahahaha
HOLY FUCKING SHIT
What happened with Smoltz…
Ok, I missed something, is Smoltz ok???
I think I missed something..Is Smoltz ok?!?!
Sorry for the double post.
Don’t know, he was stretchin’ a lot after his warm-up tosses. Threw one pitch and walked off the field.
no
Very fittingly after Smoltz leaves…
Here’s part 3 of the drinking game.
My first comments is gone.
I’m watching two games(SFG VS NYM)at once.
Yes I’ve missed it, too. Smoltzie is ok?(2)
joe thinks it’s “unrelated.” This is a nightmare. I know I’m de-lurking to post this, but this f-ing sucks.
Please, please let it be a hangnail…
espn.com says “injured right hand”.
If something is seriously wrong, I just might staart crying like a baby.
Just got in and saw that Smoltzie (i.e., the only reliable starter right now) is hurt. What is going on?
The report is that his hand is hurting, but he was also apparently favoring his shoulder. Hopefully it’s nothing too serious.
Well he did get a stinger in his right hand when he hit the ball off the end of the bat. He was however stretching out his shoulder or perhaps triceps when he was on the mound warming up.
Simpson seems to think it’s his shoulder, so it’s probably not that.
Hey Doubledawg…thanks for your thoughts. Greatly appreciated. What exactly did I do to you or Robert? Geez.
Onto something I give a sh– about, I was away for a while…how serious is the Smoltz injury? Whole is the Vulture pitching?
Let’s pray Smoltz is ok.
Do we need a candlelight vigil for Smoltz, or will a quick and quiet prayer suffice?
brewers broadcast says fractured pinky. awesome. what is that 2 months? hopefully they are wrong.
Thorman sucks. I really doubt that he’ll even be able to match 05 LaRoche.
Was Fielder’s slide as ugly as it sounded?
The sooner Salty is taught to play first base, the better. Thorman is a bench player.
seriously though, anybody know how long a broken pinky keeps a pitcher out? i dont remember anybody with a broken pinky recently to gauge off of.
John Smoltz gets injured –
drink the whole bottle.
Here Here Kyle…
The Brewers with runners in scoring position…
Emanski would not be proud. That’s not fundamental.
I just wanted to chime in to congratulate ububba for delivering one of the funniest one-liners I’ve read in a long time at the end of the previous thread. Well done, sir!
In other news, I do not understand why Pradorrward continue to get starts when we could be playing Diaz in LF and Harris at 3B.
“If Chip says “Fisted” – 2 drinks and a shower”
I Love Part 3 Davey, good work.
Wow, that is some bad defense at second base. I’m having Oberkfell flashbacks.
Did Weeks just go back-to-back?
Speaking of Tom Emanski…
Just joining the game–is there anything on Smoltzie?
Really, Mac? I was thinking about Caminiti, RIP, at first (though the plays have been at second).
Also, nothing strikes fear in a team quite like, “Now batting, pinch hitter Chris Woodward!”
Maybe, “…Martin Prado!”
I’m only marginally more frightened of Woodward as I was of Belliard, Rafael, now pinch-outing for the pitcher.
Or “Now pitching, Chad Paronto!” or “…Mark Redman!” or “Insert Braves Fifth Starter Here!”
Thank you Kyle.
Too bad that Smoltzie added some material for us today. 🙁
Or perhaps we need to reach further back to the days of Bill Veeck to find the world’s least feared hitter, other than Orr and Woodward, Eddie Gaede. Anyway, that’s my useless trivia for tonight. I apologize for any and all offense provided.
Belliard has to top that list.
I remember watching hit a ground rule double once, and realizing that was as close as he’d ever get.
Orr sucks at everything.
I just wanted to chime in to congratulate ububba for delivering one of the funniest one-liners I’ve read in a long time at the end of the previous thread. Well done, sir!
Stu, it’s not that I’m a glory hound or anything, but…ahem….
Orr is a truly multidimesional player–he can beat you in so many ways…
Do you mean that Orr can beat us, his own team, in so many ways?
What is with all these Saturday day games on the Network Formerly Known As Turner South?
Argh. Any chance we come back tonight?
If there is no comeback, can we credit the loss to Orr?
How soon until Aybar finishes detox? He’d have to be better than Woodward, Orr, and Prado.
It’s like watching Manny, Moe and Jack trying to play the infield.
Are you sure he wouldn’t be better while on drugs?
And here comes McBride, because gasoline is so good at putting out fires.
Jeff M.–of course I meant that Orr can beat us in so many ways–who else can he beat?
So, when can we bring Smoltzie back out? More importantly, when can we start one of those “countdowns” to trade for another pitcher?
Come on homey!
Sweet merciful crap.
that was awful
mac cant throw that ball. pretty sure they are trying to lose.
The Brewere have lost 6 straight; isn’t it nice that the Braves seemed determine to end it?
Meanwhile, on the self-proclaimed worldwide leader, the Giants are relying on Russ Ortiz to keep them alive. This won’t end well.
Bill Hall playing center field is another reminder of why Andruw Jones is not “overrated” as a fielder.
McCann!
Thanks, Thor.
Skip is reporting that Smoltz tweaked both his pinky and shoulder on separate plays. Smoltz will be re-evaluated tomorrow. This doesn’t sound too bad…
They said Smoltz reinjured his pinkie on the hit, and strained his shoulder while warmin’ up. Took himself out as a precaution, hopefully it ain’t nuthin’ serious.
Is it me, or is Diaz starting to look like Paul Byrd?
Damn!
Speaking of looks, the Brewers must lead the league in lantern jaws.
Nice move, Bobby. Harris is playing third instead of one of our cavalcade of non-hitters.
Of course, with our luck, he’ll commit four errors this inning.
I always liked Graffanino, and that was before the Pradorrward Experience.
McBride should come with a label that reads, “Do not use for more than 2/3 of an inning.”
I have completely given up on trying to figure out McBride.
An 8.16 ERA is Redman-like.
In two pitches it dropped to 7.98.
I guess that’s good?
Kyle,
Perspective is everything:)
I just read something on MLB.com that said Smoltz left with a neck/shoulder injury. Nothing mentioned regarding the “broken pinky”
Turnbow fell out of the ugly tree and hit every branch on the way down.
Sorry to be late on the news. Just read comments 178ff.
His goofiness is overwhelming.
27 hits through 7 by two teams. @_@
The giants just put a run up on the mut$
I hate cheering for the Giants, but any team playing nym at the moment is my second favorite. It would be nice to get a game back tonight.
Awesome. I feel as if the Mets have won every extra inning game they’ve played this year.
I think my Gameday froze.
Ouch!
Gameday has frozen, it’s not just you, Kyle.
I for one wouldn’t mind the Mets scoring a run in the bottom of the 12th, if only in hopes the game lasts for six more innings and the Giants end up winning anyway but the 18 inning monster throws the Mets out of synch for many weeks.
Bob Davidson, umpiring at the Mets game, realized he hadn’t called a balk yet tonight, and moved the Mets’ tying run into scoring position.
Since Gameday stopped, what happened to Harris?
Carlyle? What? Bobby does realize it’s a one run game, right?
What is going on in Atlanta. I have Willie frozen with 2 strikes and 2 outs. Either he is fouling off dozens of pitches or…
Harris singled but Renteria struck out on 3 pitches.
Come on Benitez!!!!
Davidson calls another balk with two outs, to bring in the tying run for the Mets.
We definitely could have used an insurance run there
Conspiracy.
Another $%@#% balk was called for the tying run!
It’s not like Benitez is a rookie. He’s been closing since the Jurassic age. That is crazy. Anyone watching it live?
Two balks to get Reyes in? Are you serious
Wow.
Home run by Delgado. Mets win. Blargh.
The Braves really need a bomb, here. To be frank with you, I miss Roachy so much. He always make me fun whatever he does.
Single, Double, and Homer for Prince.
I don’t think we have to worry about him getting the triple.
Andruw is 3-4 but we’re all agreed that if he makes an out here he’s overrated and everything is his fault, right?
Apparently the Mets are the Spurs of MLB and Bob Davidson is Steve Javie.
As a diversion, the Cavs have dismantled the Pistons to knot up the series.
Anyone have the stats? I’m near positive the Mets have won every extra inning game they’ve played this year.
The Mets are 3-0 in extra innings.
I really am past the point of disliking Reyes for being a Met. He is such an annoying little snot. Excitement be damned, give me a level-headed leader like Smoltz any day of the week.
We’re playing for the wild card.
A great win for the Mets….
And I hate them.
You are correct, Kyle. The Mets are 3-0 now in extra inning games. (The Braves are 2-2.)
Thanks Mac, Brian
It’s all Andruw’s fault.
We are all agreed that the mut$ are detestable.
The Rockies have played seven extra inning games this year (4-3) while the Mariners haven’t played any.
Well, the Braves have a chance here.
Cavs dismantled no one. Every game so far has been decided by 6 points to the home team. This game looks like it will be the same, if not closer.
At least Andruw avoided the DP.
It’s up to Francoeur & Thorman.
Yuck.
Now, we need a pinch runner for McCann, but we’ve already used Orr and Woodward, who aren’t useful for anything else.
Oh, boy.
Reverse-jinx, baby!
lets get a saccie!
More importantly, he’s used Saltalamacchia. If they ditched one of the Three Losers, we could have Pena up and he’s much faster than McCann.
Dix,
The yahoo game is way off.
http://sports.yahoo.com/nba/boxscore;_ylt=AjoV7Fqr_ja9jmXxfx9yr1q8vLYF?gid=2007052905
Chipper not even available to hit in this spot? Thats bad. He could hit a sac fly with the bat in his mouth.
I think it’s time Thorman went.
That was predictable. Thorman is putrid.
Thorman just lost his job.
Thorman = Useless
Its 91-87 Cavs. Gonna be final.
that is just really bad baseball
Thorman needs to get off the roids or go back to Richmond.
We have way too many useless guys.
terrible way to finish the game. That runner has to be scored somehow.
Argh
Fifteen hits for four runs. Back-to-back K’s with the tying run at third. That was just bad baseball, badly managed and badly executed.
booooooooooooo!
Hate to be the team to break the Brewers’ streak of horrificness
God I hate Scott Thorman. That guy doesn’t even have a five cent head.
come on matt
nevermind. This sucked. 15 hits, 4 runs, and the unspeakable.
Why are the Braves hitting so well and not getting any damn runs? How many times are we gonna tie or outhit the oppposition only to lose? It’s one thing to have Andruw striking out cause you know at some point (now) he’s going to come around. But what does Thorman do for you other than hit the random home-run?
Some lousy losses this year, but that one feels worse than the others.
5 games back, good ,very good!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
I wish I could get a read on this team. While this month hasn’t been as bad as it seems, I feel like we are just plunging further and further into the rest of the pack.
The Braves are further and further behind the Mets…
Alex is a lunatic ?