I didn’t want to do this. I REALLY didn’t want to do this. But the Braves have left me no choice.
It’s time to bring out the big guns.
I didn’t want to do this. I REALLY didn’t want to do this. But the Braves have left me no choice.
It’s time to bring out the big guns.
Rachel Ward is hot.
A really good movie thats a remake of a great movie……1948 Out Of The Past….Robert Mitchum, Kirk Douglas, and an unbelievably good-looking Jane Greer…..highly recommended!
Damn you, Braves.
Got JC’d…I’ve heard Peraza is a better bet to eventually move to second or center than to third.
Centerfield? Now, please.
I think the Trout thoughts are pretty pointless. Every year we have a first round pick, and every year there are players taken after the first round that become stars. Every year that the first round pick doesn’t become a star could lead you to say, “We could have had Johnny Superstar but we took Mike Minor (or some other first round pick).” And of course, if we should have taken Trout, then why didn’t 23 other teams not take Trout?
@2 – Too young…had to Google…and while doing so, Wikipedia informed me…that song was nominated for an Oscar?!?
Chris Johnson is brutal. The only thing about him I enjoy is when he craps the bed (often) whether or not we’ll get to see him throw a temper tantrum. I find those amusing in a self-loathing kind of way.
Was revisiting the Teixeira trade the other day. Still sucks, but I don’t think it’s quite as bad as everyone makes it out to be. Andrus is a good defender but can’t hit, Salty is meh, Feliz is holistically an above average reliever, and Harrison had two decent years and is probably done.
Each showed some flash at one point, but outside Andrus, I wouldn’t rely on any of them long-term….and even Andrus is overpaid for what he gives you. As far as relative to the team, Andrus would’ve been great during the SS dark ages before Simba, but I don’t see any of the others making a huge difference. Don’t get me wrong, it still sucks (especially as we didn’t make the playoffs either year), but if I’m going back in time and changing a trade, it’s Waino for Drew a million times over before the Tex deal.
Wainright for Drew was definitely the worse of the two, though did we not make the playoffs that year with Drew? He did have a very good year for us.
Fun fact: Drew played his second highest game total the year he played for us. He played in 146 for Boston one year, 145 for us, and the next closest was 139. That guy was held together with a ball of yarn.
Yeah, we did make the playoffs with Drew…and honestly, he had his career year with the Braves (have said that a million times to Cards fans in desperation). Waino is a 5 win a year pitcher though. Unless we had won the WS, I’m taking Waino every time.
Drew had his career year and an MVP caliber season with us, helping the Braves win number 13. Eli Marrero, also in that trade, also had his career year as a platoon player.
John Kruk says we’re going to run away with the division. Aren’t you excited?
BJ shows us that his pitch recognition isn’t good at all and carps to the umpire on his way back to the dugout. See, he’s not just a schmuck, he’s a whiny schmuck.
Edit: That was the Braves’ 91st double of the year, while every other MLB team has at least 101.
BJ whining about strike 3 down the middle.
OH MY GOSH!
BJ Upton (yelling at the umpire after a clear strike three): “That’s not a strike on Trout.”
Dude, it’s NOT a conspiracy against you. You just suck. It’s not the umpire, it’s not the coaching staff, it’s not stars getting special treatment, it’s not the groundscrew, it’s not Chip Caray, YOU SUCK.
Gosh, he drives me crazy with his deflection. Own your baggage.
I interned for ESPN Radio in Tampa (back when we had an affiliate) when I was in college and BUpton was in TB, and the host on the show I worked on said, “BJ Upton is a five-tool player with one-and-a-half tool production.” At the time, I felt like he was being harsh because it was 2009 and BJ was coming off a 2008 season where he went .273/.383/.401 as a 23-year old for a 108 OPS with 44 SBs in CF.
Boy, was I wrong. I’d take one-and-a-half tools at this point.
BJ flushes the leather.
To quote Ring Lardner, “Although he is a very poor fielder, he is a very poor hitter.”
I’m a very late adapter. Finally got an HD tv. BJ sucks in HD just as much as he does in SD.
What happens to this being the year for Minor to step forward? Dude’s control is crud.
Minor is really up in the zone. This could be a long night.
I hope the Braves come back for you guys and make me sorry I gave up.
The Braves just aren’t very good this year. Too many guys not having productive years.
I have no confidence in Minor’s ability to keep the ball in the park against right-handed power hitters.
Minor in the Steroid Era would have been a frightening proposition for us.
In Minors, defense the Trout HR was low inside half. Just a hell of hit.
According to Peanut, Braves are considering promoting Bethancourt, moving Gattis to LF, Heyward to CF, and Jupton to RF. Oh my…
Did no one in the front office watch El Oso in the outfield last year? I love Gattis to pieces, but this isn’t going to end well.
I notice the timestamp on Bowman’s story was 8:34 p.m. EDT tonight, not long after B.J.’s home-plate outburst. I wonder if that was the final straw, and after that was when Wren or someone connected to him texted Peanut to give him the green light to publish.
That’s a dumbass idea.
@27
The braves FO sure do seem like they like to handle things through social media.
Heyward to center isn’t a dumb idea. Gattis to LF is. But you gotta do something. You can carry Simmons glove but not BJ and CJ too. No options at 3b means you have to manipulate the the OF situation.
Gross…then we pay BJ 50 MMM to sit on the bench for 3 years while Gattis flounders around in LF?
@31 what BJ is getting paid is irrelevant. To have a chance to compete the Braves have to bench him and manipulate the lineup.
Just a reminder that Chris Johnson still mashes LHP. There are options. All Wren needs to do is find a platoon partner. Which was his original plan for 3B in the first place.
I think it’s pretty clear they’re telling BJ to shut the heck up. That’s just embarrassing to the organization for a player who sucks so bad to make a comment like that, as if that’s a reason why he’s struggling. It’s like watching Elaine from Seinfeld dance; I’m embarrassed on behalf of BJ and he’s oblivious.
As for the plan coming to fruition, sheesh, I’d hate for it to come to that, but if that’s what it takes to improve the club, then so be it. It’s hard to do much worse than BJ Upton, especially if you consider the seemingly cancerous attitude he projects, and Gattis can either be a mediocre catcher or mediocre left fielder. It doesn’t really matter. If it gets Bethancourt in the lineup and he can produce better offense than BJ, then it does make sense.
Put that guy in CF
34- The defensive downgrade in the outfield also needs to be considered, and it’s likely to be quite substantial. Gattis was 6-10 runs below average in LF in 48 games last year, depending on whose defensive stats you believe, and we’d also turn an outstanding defensive RF into an averageish CF with increased injury risk. (I also remember JUpton going into a defensive funk when he was moved to RF, but I could be wrong.)
Man, Trout must be pretty unhappy with Jason Heyward.
The irony of Trout getting robbed twice by Heyward makes me dream that one day Heyward could be something close to Trout. Oh, to dream…
I’ve given up on that. I just want Heyward to be good at something besides defense.
He’s a good baserunner and has a decent walk rate.
I’d take 2012 offensive Jason and 2014 defensive Jason in a heartbeat. That’s just a ::insert above-average WAR total:: WAR player.
@36
But the defensive upgrade at catcher also needs to be considered. Heyward and BUpton are a wash in center as far as I’m concerned, so while you’ll downgrade defensively in RF, you’ll wash again in left and upgrade at catcher. Once again, I think it comes down to offensive improvement and “attitude adjustment”. Of course, Bethancourt has a .672 OPS at AAA this year.
Is it REALLY that hard to find a league average hitter in center? We found it at second now.
40- What offensive improvement? Based on his performance in Gwinnett, we probably can’t expect Bethancourt to hit better than BUpton, and we get a defensive downgrade in LF and RF that probably more than cancels the upgrade at C (remember, Gattis is a plus pitch-framer and average at stopping stolen bases, by most metrics). Not to mention that it moves five guys to different positions or levels. It’s just not worth it.
@40 – Yes its tough to find a league average CF.
Maybe you give Cunningham a shot.
On a happier note, way to be, El Oso Blanco! It’ll look like a line drive in the box score.
@41
I get what you’re saying, and I also doubt Bethancourt is an upgrade over BUpton. Bethancourt has a .672 OPS at AAA; Upton has a .633 OPS.
Following through with this could just be a ploy to piss BJ Upton off to get him to play better. With Uggla, there’s clearly diminished physical skills. With BJ, there doesn’t seem to be any physical reason for why he’s turned into a pumpkin offensive and defensively. In fact, he should be entering the prime of his career. Something is not right between the ears, and considering how arrogant his comment earlier in the game seems to indicate, perhaps the only way the Braves feel like they can get through to him is by putting him on the bench.
You could just start Schafer in center or Doumit in right. SOME combination of all of these scenarios should be able to produce a better result right now. And if it puts Upton on the bench, that might get through to him.
@42
So then is it that difficult to find a league average outfielder? Heyward can play center, and Upton could play right. Can we not find some platoon of mediocre left fielders that can produce a .750 OPS? The bar is so low for Upton replacement.
45- That’s the whole idea behind the concept of replacement level. Yes, it IS that difficult to find league-average players; we just need to find someone we can live with and not be reminded that the Braves are paying BUpton close to $100,000 a game to suck and whine.
John Kruk is saying the same things about BJ Uptons swing that I’ve been saying for 2 years. My wife humors me and says “that’s what you’ve been saying!” Actually it’s what everyone’s been saying. Kruk is too nice and too professional to bring up BJ’s attitude so he says “you wish he could simplify that”. Yes, we do wish, but we only wish he would. He obviously could, but he’s too psychologically invested in his approach to cut his losses. He just wonders “when they’re gonna start falling”. He spent all offseason (supposedly) working. At what, pray tell? Repeating the same absurd bat waggle to wind up late and under every fastball? But boy when he connects that golf swing on a pitch down and in, it’s majestic–just enough variable interval reinforcement to condition his rat brain to keep doing the same thing.
STELLA!!! LA STELLA!!!
Jersey Boy!
La Stella picked a heck of a time to get an XBH there. If only Regression were faster.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qVrU0JNAgqI&feature=kp
Perhaps the thinking is that putting Gattis in LF will get his bat in the lineup every day. So it’s not simply trading Upton’s bat for Bethancourt’s.
@46
Thank you. I understand the concept of replacement level. My point is this season is very winnable, we are leading our division, but we have this clear blackhole that would be partly solved by at least a league average center fielder. It’s puzzling that we can’t deal an acceptable package of players to shore up such a glaring weakness. The question was more rhetoric; the answer is no.
I think I have the solution.
Move La Stella to center field. He’d be the prototype singles hitting center fielder, maybe even steal a base every now and then. Finally center field would be a productive hitting position.
Move BJ to second. His bat might not be all that great but he’s a big improvement on Uggla.
Offensive woes fixed.
He still sucks.
@54
Love it.
52- I thought so. It just bothered me that you were asking if it’s that hard to find a league-average outfielder when about half the league’s OFs are worse, on average.
If we give Cunningham a try in CF, then that’s what we need to do and nothing else. No Gattis in LF, no Heyward in CF.
Edit: Minor snuck up on us to deliver a fine performance, which we now have to hope the bullpen doesn’t ruin.
Why not platoon Schaefor and Bupton for a while, then send the fool to AAA when that doesn’t work and play Doumit a bit more in LF?
Yeah, I don’t think replacing BUpton with Bethancourt by itself makes the Braves better. It weakens the outfield defense and I don’t think Bethancourt will be any better with the bat than Bupton. The only plus is that it gets Gattis in the lineup everyday.
And I agree with @33 that we need a platoon partner for Johnson.
Baby Bedrock. Man I am old.
58 — Schafer isn’t an answer to anything except who is the next guy to be DFA’d.
61- I’d rather have him than BUpton, even without taking the latter’s massive paychecks into account. This incarnation of Success is a spare outfielder worth keeping around.
And congratulations to the Spurs for beating the Miami Egos.
Catcher wanted up the ladder, Bedrock went up the crane.
Could Gattis’s last two hits have been hit any more softly?
Why aren’t all superstars like Tim Duncan?
You guys did well without me. Should I leave again?
Yeah I’m not sure what that move would help accomplish. We weaken our defense in both corner OF positions and it doesn’t upgrade the offense. Id rather us find platoon partners for CJ and Bupton.
Wow…we were being outhit 11-1 at one point in the fifth inning. Not used to in-game turnarounds like this.
59-we had a platoon partner for Johnson. His name was fat Juan. He is a positive WAR player for the blue jays this year.
I think the only thing the move effectively does is to tell BUpton to go screw himself.
Fat Juan didn’t produce and we cut bait
68 — Yeah, now we need a new one.
69-benching bj with the stipulation that he change his ridiculous waggle-cock-hitch is the only leverage we have. He otherwise is not willing to admit to himself that there’s something wrong with his swing
We traded JJ Hoover for him. There’s got to be another JJ Hoover we can trade for another Fat Juan. There’s got to be another Charles Thomas somewhere. There’s got to be another… Chris Johnson. Seriously, the guy was a gift.
70–you’re using that saying incorrectly, and it was more that wren was enamored with regressions fluke positive war season
As much as I would love to see Gattis hit every day…let’d be real, they aren’t sitting BJ yet. They are just publicly telling him that his shit is getting old and that his poor attitude is hurting the Braves brand.
To be fair, CJ has had 3 positive WAR seasons.
And in more interest of fairness to CJ, he does have a 104 OPS+ for his career, he been trending up on OPS+ in his career, and is 29 years old. There’s reason to believe that he’s just slumping and not…. regressing.
76-if we go my rWAR he was about a net 0 war when the braves acquired him. I seem to remember he had neutral or reverse splits though.
BJ Upton has a positive WAR this year, believe it or not (thanks to defense). He’s just merely bad instead of worse than replacement level.
Fat Juan had a sub .300 OBP against RH pitching. That’s not really a productive platoon partner.
Chris Johnson better be slumping or he’s a good 3 wins below replacement over 162. But these things fluctuate, and the braves paid him as if he were a perennial +2 war player. Maybe he’s replacement level, and we shouldn’t expect another season of 2 wins. Then it will be yet another wren overpay. Lets be honest, wren has yet to sign a veteran to a non-disastrous long-term deal. He managed to inflict the Albert belle on Baltimore when he was there. For the braves his legacy is Kenshin, Lowe, bupton, uggla. All disasters. Lets see how Johnson turns out
79-I know, which is why it’s insane to talk about replacing him. Bj can hit .210 and be plus war due to defense and baserunning. Don’t get me wrong–I hate the shit out of him, but we need him, and he can still be productive for us. We gain little with gattis in left (maybe nothing)
@32 – As Rob pointed out, Bethancourt won’t be a better hitter than BJ, and any upgrade in defense he has over Gattis will be more than negated by JUpton vs. Heyward in RF and Gattis vs. JUpton in LF.
And even if you bring him up, we’re now supposed to believe Fredi will have the magic touch mixing and matching these guys?
I agree BJ sucks, but I don’t see how bringing up an all-defense catcher will fix it.
Carpenter is throwing 97-98 tonight. Much better than the 94-95 I recall seeing for most of this season.
82 — I think everyone here agrees with that. I said the same thing @59.
Oh well for that. Carpenter almost hit Trout and then beans Pujols with a 4 run lead.
83-And imagine frediot with 4 catchers on the roster. Can’t use any of them bc what if the other 3 for hurt???
Pujols is all “wtf I’m taking that personally. Y u not thro him out ump? Obv he try to bean me bottom 9 with game on the line!”
Either Carpenter has no clue where the ball is headed, or he is the dumbest pitcher alive.
Carpenter is pitching his way off this team.
I think the ESPN gun is juiced. It had Minor touching 93-94.
89 – I think I’d believe either one.
ESPN gun is always hot. I kind of enjoy it though.
Didn’t think we’d win this game for a long time. But we did. Awesome. I’m going to bed.
I can’t trust Carpenter anymore. He should be demoted.
Even with all the problems, still in 1st!
95 — I’m pretty sure Carpenter is out of options. Isn’t that how we acquired him…when someone had to DFA him and we claimed him?
@82 and 83 – You’d get stronger up the middle defensively and Gattis would get 100 more AB’s. Because JUpton is so bad in LF, replacing him with Gattis wouldn’t an enormous downgrade. But RF defense, of course, would be. Bethancourt would have to be the second coming of Charles Johnson for the realignment to be an overall improvement, and it wouldn’t be much of one. I agree: staying with Upton in CF makes the sense.
Thats the issue, we need an offensive upgrade. Improving our defense up the middle and decreasing it in each corner doesn’t improve the team.
98-Charles Johnson was an above average offensive catcher during his prime. He hit .300 with 30 hr one year. He wasn’t all glove. Bethancourt is probably going to be more like Henry blanco than Charles Johnson.
Bethancourt has been an all glove/no hit player at pretty much every level ever. Maybe he becomes Yadier Molina 2.0 in five years, but that’s just best-case-scenario wishcasting and doesn’t address the fact that this season he can’t hit AAA pitching. Given the specific things that are hampering this team, Bethancourt is not the answer. I imagine this is more about internal politics than about an actual plan.
It’s clearly about sending a message to BJ, and it’s unfortunate that Bethancourt is going to believe for a second that he’ll be a big league catcher this year.
It’s one thing for a player to lose his temper, not hustle, hot-dog a play, but it’s another thing all together to take a pitch right down the pipe and insinuate to the umpire that they’re conspiring against him. That brings a level of delusion that I didn’t think an elite athlete could reach. It’s a real head-scratcher for him to think that only Mike Trout gets that pitch called a ball.
Did he make comments after the game? I can’t find any
@102
Yeah, those ESPN microphones were really an unfortunate circumstance for BJ tonight.
You know, maybe this is a way to hype up Bethancourt so that he will be worth more in a trade. No way the Braves are seriously considering this.
Who can figure this bunch? So far, this certainly ain’t last year’s team.
Big room to improve, but somehow still on top of the division.
At least we’re scoring more runs all of a sudden. TLS (perhaps in conjunction with getting to face Cam Bedrosian) has been just what the doctor ordered.
Recap is up.