Marlins 6, Braves 5

Atlanta Braves vs. Florida Marlins – Box Score – September 19, 2011 – ESPN.

I just don’t understand it. It doesn’t make any sense. Having rallied back from 4-1 down to take the lead, with the Marlins down to their last strike, the Braves lost when Chipper Jones lost a chopper in the lights and Craig Kimbrel, who previously had hardly ever allowed home runs, allowed a two-run walkoff homer to Omar Infante, of all people.

Mike Minor gave up solo homers to Giancarlo Stanton in the first and the third innings. Jason Heyward cut it to 2-1 with a solo homer in the sixth, but Minor allowed a two-run shot in the bottom of the inning to make it 4-1.

Dan Uggla homered leading off the seventh, and then the Braves got three more runs, all of them being driven in without balls leaving the infield — an infield single my Michael Bourn, a bases-loaded walk to Martin Prado, and an error letting Chipper reach.

Eric O’Flaherty allowed a couple of baserunners but got through the seventh, and Jonny Venters pitched a 1-2-3 eighth, though two of his outs were flyouts which indicates he’s still messed up. Then that happened.

204 thoughts on “Marlins 6, Braves 5”


  2. For Fredi detractors complaining that overuse was likely going to lead to something like this…well, here we are.

  3. I think it’s over; I expect them to win no more than two games the rest of the way.

    I’m sorry, I don’t buy the overwork excuse. He just blew it. He sucks at this point like the whole team.

  4. I think it’s over; I expect them to win no more than two games the rest of the way.

    I’m sorry, I don’t buy the overwork excuse. He just blew it. He sucks at this point like the whole team.

  5. It’s over for us. 2 1/2 up when we find new ways to lose and the Cardinals CAN’T lose, it’s over. Cannot believe we found a way to lose this game. Just an embarrassment.

  6. Wonderful thing about technology is that I can just keep not updating my twitter timeline which is currently stuck on sometime around the 7th inning and it’s like the rest of the game never happened. Looks good for a Braves win you guys!

  7. ill always remember that shitty ass football stadium for nights like this. god i hate that place. good riddance.

  8. This is a great thread. It’s in response to a terrible thing, but most of us are really down, and ILoveEmmaStone is the one trying to keep our spirits high.

  9. Fredi, after last game of regular season: “you’ve just got to tip your cap.”

    It wouldn’t bother me so much if it was any team other than LaRussa’s.

  10. Mac, it’s time to put the DOOMED thing up there in the page subtitle again.

    We are doomed…..DOOMED!!!!!!

  11. we still lead by 2.5… it’s not ideal… but it’s better to be up than behind

    I thought you were just charmingly soft-headed, but you really are yanking people’s chains. I didn’t think you were a troll in the classic sense, but I was totally wrong about that.

  12. What’s with all the pessimism? We’ve got Venters and Kimbrel warming up and they’re usually money!

  13. The Braves have gone from a team who does just enough to win close to a team who does just enough to lose close. Funny how that happens.


  14. If we blow this, I’m blaming Mac. I mean, everybody with a brain could see he needed to get Phil Collins up and warming in the ‘pen, but Noooooooo….

    He’s had to go all Frediot on us and keep Phil in his ‘proper closer position’.

    This is all on you Mr. T.

  15. Dammit, Twitter finally auto-updated. Hypothesis: The season started a downhill slide when Scott Proctor was released – baseball allows only so much talent in a pitching staff, so when Proctor departed, the suck had to find a new repository and it spread amongst the remaining pitchers.

  16. I blame it on Sam. When the toilet bowl started swirling a couple weeks ago, he was all over us for prognosticating the potential for future defeats. He’s been pretty scarce of late.

  17. “Charmingly Soft-Headed” will be the name of my punk band some day.

    And I second the Phil Collins notion. If we lose tomorrow, Cannibal Corpse may be in order.

  18. Well the Cards get to play the Mets, Cubs at home and then end with the hapless Astros at Houston .. Braves finish with Marlins, our nemesis Nationals on road and home to face best team in baseball (who just dropped 3 of 4 to Cards) .. the schedule sure doesnt fall in our favor .. it may be over folks .. wonder why St Louis aint ending with the Brewers.??

  19. It’s hard for me to feel bitter about the Cardinals’ schedule. The Braves have nobody to blame but themselves. If anything, right now I’m feeling bitter towards the Braves–I suppose this is my de facto position in times of absurdity.

  20. This isnt a schedule issue. We were playing the Mets at home while St Louis was playing in Philly without Matt Holliday. Schedule has been in our favor for a while and we are just playing like crap. It started with the blown save in the 1st game in St Louis.

  21. csg is right. The schedule has totally favored us going back a couple weeks. We’ve just lost all chance of exploiting it. No rest for any regulars, gotta go full out the rest of the way. It’s playoffs time right now.

    Hopefully by Thursday morning we’ll have treated the Marlins like our bitch and won 2 out of 3. That would be the normal course of things any other time… maybe by some miracle it will be that way. We’ll see.

  22. We are in Free Fall: this team has looked bad for weeks and my hopes for it once it gets into the playoffs have not been high. Yet, I am not sure that I am ready for associations with the 1964 Phils, the 1978 Red Sox, and the Mets of 2007 and 2008. But these losses have been pathetic and I am trying to finda way to be at peace for the worst–if and when it comes…..

  23. At this point, it really doesn’t seem to matter if the Braves make the playoffs or not. If they don’t remember how to play baseball, it’s just a difference of a 162 game season or 165. And right about now would be a good time to remember. Better yet, last week sometime.

  24. Wow. Way to support your team! Geez, I hope if the Nats ever get close and maybe need to get over that last bump their fans don’t desert them like you guys.

  25. @6 Love the ‘Airplane’ reference.

    EGADS. Wasn’t it just a couple of days ago all here were saying it the Braves were really going to have to try to lose the wild card? I swear. a lot.

    Trying to be a glass 1/10th full guy I guess we have to remember that this team has overcome some adversity this season. Sigh.

  26. Last night will do one of two things; 1) It will snow ball and we will be cooked.
    2) We get pissed and steamroll these fools.

    As inconcsistent as our hitting has been, our pitching has been the goat. Our two best pitchers blew the last two games for us. Two fifths of our rotation is hurt. One of the other starters has fallen a part. We have two rookies who are good fo five innings and Hudson.

    It is time to go to a four man roatiaon and try to get Hudson three more starts. If he wins those and we can find two more wins somewhere, we will be fine.

    I think we the we can at least hold on for a one game playoff, but who knows.

  27. To me, the problem is the Braves can’t get ahead and coast. This was another game where the combination of bad starting pitching and inability to score early put them behind the eight ball. Even if they had won, they aren’t playing solid baseball. It’s been this way all year, really, but things are catching up to them. How many times have the Braves scored early, built on the lead, and won comfortably? Not may, I bet. When you are always relying on the bullpen or late rallies to bail you out, this is what can happen.

    And, of course, it doesn’t help that the Cards got hot right now. This will probably keep LaRussa in St. Louis for another year even if they don’t make it.

  28. Fredi gets the blame from me. He played small ball, dumb frediball, forcing close games, and so abused the best pitchers in his bullpen until they couldn’t do it as well. I also blame Larry Parrish for whatever it is he didn’t do. If he turns out to have damaged the arms of a couple of the best young relief pitchers the Braves have seen in the last decade, he should be fired for damaging corporate assets.

    Even if the Braves limp into the playoffs, Fredi already burned up the bullpen.

  29. Marc,
    I only remember one game the Braves were comfortably ahead, 5 to 0, and they lost that one.

    I would take any Braves pitcher with a winning record in AAA over Lowe right now. He’s just about a guarnateed loss.

  30. I also think after the “Second All Star Break” we turned it off. We decided to rest guys and coast. Now we need to turn it back on and it has been hard.

    We did score five runs last night. But what we really need is Delgatto to be great tonight. That is a lot to ask. We also need Lowe to step up. On top of that we face the Marlins hottest pitchers and then Strasburg.

  31. Was Joe Simpson crying in the postgame last night? Saw this in the previous thread…it sure looked like it.

  32. I’m not ready to step onto the ledge yet. The great thing about baseball is, like Smitty said, this loss can provide a catalyst for some play that could take us all the way through October.

    After all, if the Braves were gonna be ice cold, I’d rather it be now rather than two weeks from now. We just need some guys to get hot and carry us through. It’s happened all last decade to the D-backs, Angels, Giants, Red Sox, etc. Historically, the teams that peak in early September rarely continue their peak in October.

    This can still be our year.

  33. I dare say… I’ve never seen a ground ball get lost in the lights before. How unlucky can you get? Still figured that Kimbrell had it though, and somehow Infante turned on a fastball. Just unreal.

    I don’t blame Fredi for overusing the bullpen. When you play a ton of close games your best relievers tend to get used and it’s the fault of the offense for not getting on base and scoring early runs so we don’t have to use all three key guys every single game. What else is Fredi supposed to do in so many 1 run games? Trot Linebrink out there? Then we’d all be bitching about how dumb that is… He’s really done as good a job as he can in managing the innings they’re going especially in the second half.

    Still up 2.5 with 8 to go. Let’s not panic… yet.

  34. 63- Honestly, I’m thinking of Bump Bailey in the movie of The Natural.

    Bump: I lost it in the sun.

    Pop: (looks up at clouds) Blinding.

    61- Not to belabor the obvious, but we’d better find a peak real fast in late September (the Mets seem unlikely to help us, running Pelfrey out there against Edwin Jackson in St. Louis tonight) or there won’t be an October.

  35. I’m traditionally the portrait of optimism, but after something like that, i gotta wonder if there’s some kind of ‘hand of fate’ at work here. Infante off Kimbrel? insanity.

    But as some have said, who cares? We’re still in it, and we’ve already experienced a full decade of clinching early and resting everyone and then losing in the first round. How we’re playing this week really has no bearing on the playoffs, as long as we can play well enough to get in!

    Hanson might be ready for that 163rd game vs. stl ;)

  36. @66

    He might be, but they wouldn’t start him. Hudson is slotted for 162 so that means it would be Beachy’s turn, agaist proabaly Kyle Loshe or Carpenter.

  37. Doesn’t feel any better today either.

    However… we’re still ahead & still have the best opportunity of the 3 teams to take the Wild Card.

    Just gotta win a few ballgames, starting tonight.

  38. If you want to start feeling better about the Braves, do what I just did:

    Go to Facebook, log onto the Baseball Hall of Fame poll and vote for Ernie Johnson to make the short list for the Ford C. Frick award. They’re taking the top 10 vote getters and making them eligible for induction into the hall. Even if Ernie doesn’t ultimately win, just by making the shortlist his profile will be raised, respect further garnered, and more discussion about his important legacy as a broadcaster that truly did bring baseball and the Braves to the whole region of the South.

    You can vote once a day every day for the rest of the month.

  39. Note: Boston, a team that’s in the same boat, has to pull for the Yankees. Both Wild Card teams hope their biggest rivals, each from New York, win their next few games.


  40. So this is about how I feel about the human race right now:

    Satan then returned to his den, poured himself a drink, sat back, and watched as Man created intoxicants, lawn furniture, money, fatty foods, aqueducts, neon signs, automobiles, other gods, poetry, intercontinental ballistic missiles, the electric chair, Smurfs, vaccines, deodorant, art, and sitcoms.

    -Jim Knipfel, “These Children Who Come At You With Knives And Other Fairy Tales”

  41. If the Braves don’t get hot but St. Louis struggles too, then I won’t matter because they’ll be one and done. The Braves have to get hot in the last week, not only to win the Wild Card, but also have a shot in the playoffs. I’m not rooting for NY; I want the Braves to win their way to the playoffs, not backdoor to the playoffs.

  42. We need some positive thoughts. Here’s one:

    Do y’all realize that in a few months it will be twenty years since Magic Johnson announced he had contracted HIV? Back then, I never thought I’d be typing those words. So happy to be able to do so.

  43. 60 – I’ll tell you what I saw and maybe someone can corroborate. Joe’s eyes looked like they had welled up a little bit. Joe and Chip were both obviously upset. Chip had his arms crossed as they went back and forth with the Braves Postgame Live folks (Jordan and the other guy). Chip looked p*ssed; Joe looked unnerved, almost like he felt real bad for Kimbrel. I was thinking it and then my wife said “Is he crying?”

  44. Not to be overly optimistic, but this reminds me in some ways of 2006, when the Cardinals were gagging down the stretch and the Braves beat Houston a couple of times to save them. Then they ended up winning it all. Not suggesting that will happen here, but baseball is a funny game.

    However, as noted before, my preferred approach is to assume the Braves are toast and hope to be pleasantly surprised. It makes it less painful. It’s no fun having your team struggle down the stretch, even if they do make it–and even if they were to win the WS. Frankly, I find it hard to respect a team that can’t play in September for whatever reason. If I was a Cardinal fan, I would feel like the 2006 title was somewhat tainted considering their poor record and how lucky they were to get in. Of course, like the Braves, they could point to previous years where they won 100 games and didn’t win.

  45. I have an acquaintance that has been infected with HIV for several years and remains in good health. It’s amazing considering what the outlook was a few years ago.

  46. Who wouldve thought??

    Jhey – .261/.407/.370
    AAG – .352/.373/.574
    Bmac – .183/.310/.300
    Prado – .243/.273/.338

  47. @79 – it sure seemed to me that Heyward was taking a ton of walks (and .407 OBP confirms). Too bad no one is stepping up & driving him in (though I know that at least some of those walks are of the ‘earlier in the year-McLouth-in-the-8-spot’ pitching around you to get to the pitcher variery – but they still count)…

  48. I will be in Italy for the remainder of the MLB season. After watching the ending to last night’s game, I’m hoping a little ignorance will be bliss.

  49. Gotta feel like Cards have the better team at the moment. Still, our odds are supposedly just below 80%, though personally I wouldn’t lay anyone better than 2-1. Perhaps last night can be the jolt to get this team fired up.

  50. Vincituri te salutant (We who are about to lose salute you):

    Bourn cf
    Prado lf
    Jones 3b
    Uggla 2b
    McCann c
    Freeman 1b
    Gonzalez ss
    Heyward rf
    Delgado p

  51. Was Joe Simpson crying in the postgame last night? Saw this in the previous thread…it sure looked like it.

    That was me that asked, and no one answered. Seems others noticed Simpson appeared to be actually crying tears during the start of the post-game show.

  52. The problem with talking about “odds” and “probability” is that it sort of assumes that the games are random, like flipping coins, ie. a sort of 50-50 odds each game. But they aren’t random; you can’t just assume that a team will win x percent of their remaining games.

    This to me is also the problem when teams get way ahead and start saying all we have to do is, say, play .500. But winning games doesn’t just happen.

  53. Sure win for the cards tonight so an absolutely must-win game for the Braves or things will really get dicey. Oh, and Heyward should be batting second.

  54. So how will the Braves lose tonight’s game?
    a. no offense
    b. sucky starting pitching
    c. imploding bullpen
    d. Fredi f***s up
    e. all of the above

  55. I think tonight’s loss will be of the more usual mediocre-starting-pitching-combines-with-generally-weak-offense variety. So, 5-2.

  56. If only the Mets fired Randolph after the 2007 season, we’d have precedent in which to demand Gonzalez’s dismissal after the completion of this collapse.

  57. Second and third, no outs, no runs. Guys, just forfeit the rest of the schedule if this is the level of effort you intend to give.

  58. The more things change, the more things stay the same.

    That inning died when Chipper decided to swing at a 3-1 pitch in the dirt and basically bailed the Marlins’ pitcher out.

  59. After that inning, just to rub salt in the wound, the first commercial was a “get your Braves’ postseason tickets now!” one.

  60. Is it just me or does Joe Simpson seem pissed off? He’s really being harsh on the team for pitch selection.

  61. 100- How on God’s green earth did Mark Bowman (or any other sentient human) write this article and headline? Even if they haven’t paid attention to Venters’ or the Braves’ play in September, since when to tired pitchers pitch better or have lower injury risk? This isn’t about 2011 anymore, it’s about the career of a potentially great reliever.

    AAG. Sure. Why not? Nothing else about this team makes sense anymore…

  62. fairly efficient start by delgado there. keep it up kid.

    Ububba, the thrashers / jets are playing their first exhibition game tonight. a split squad affair against columbus. and this town is berserk. neat to see big league hockey where it ought to be. Maybe the Marlins can find the same when they finally move.

    edit: great start!

  63. I don’t know whether to be happy or throw more stuff after that HR by Agon.

    The braves need a couple of those with a couple of people in the next week and we will be all set.

  64. Nice hustle, Jason.

    It’s been a bit of “conventional wisdom” about sinkerballers. You always heard the same thing about Chien-Ming Wang (different kinda sinker, of course…)

  65. There you go…

    I certainly have mixed feelings about the Thrashers/Jets move, but there’s no doubt that hockey’ll get the attention it deserves up there.

  66. Jonny Venters Batters faced 2010: 375. 2011: 343.
    Craig Kimbrel 2010: 318. 2011: 296.
    This includes the minors of course, but still, I think we’re kind of overreacting on the “fatigue” thing.

  67. Another game of listening to some drunk moron. Sometimes hearing a specific fan constantly is amusing (Pirate girl), but this ain’t one of those times.

  68. the bottom of 2 feels very important.

    #123, for sure, and not to gloat at all. I know exactly how it feels to lose a team. Frankly, I was hoping Phoenix would come back. For the poetic irony and all that.

    anyways, sorry for the interruption, go braves.

  69. @130: In the nineties, I was at a Mets game at Shea where this kid yelled at Lance Johnson for the entire game. “Johnson, you suck! You suck, Johnson!” non-stop, for three hours. At first it was annoying, then excruciating, but then, strangely, sometime in the third hour, it became very Zen-like. To this day, when I’m really stressed, I say to myself “johnson you suck you suck johnson.”

  70. There you go, Randall.

    Well, I’m really a Devils fan, but I do have friends who were genuine fans of the Thrash. I really feel bad for them.

    Went to a Coyotes game once in Glendale. Couldn’t say it was the most enthusiastic hockey crowd I’ve ever seen. Everybody seemed to be doing everything except watching the game.

    Ever sit in the bleachers of the old Yankee Stadium?

  71. We need to warm up somebody in the pen. Delgado has nothing tonight. Of course Fredi won’t do that

  72. @134: All the time–back then Yankee Stadium bleacher seats were cheap (6 dollars?)and easy to get. My first bleacher seats game was a Tigers game–the Yankees had just traded Ruben Sierra, and this was his first game back. I cannot repeat the vile things screamed at Mr. Sierra that afternoon, but they were quite shocking for this sheltered Southern boy.

  73. OMG, Marlins local broadcast had an interview with a fan dressed as a “Miami Princess Leia” on Star Wars Night at the park. Wow. Anyone else see that?

  74. To my discomfort, I agree with certain people here. Delgado has delivered all that he’s going to. Falling behind 3-0 to Stanton is a bad way to live.

  75. Whew. Dare I say… maybe this is our night?

    Oh, yeah. Certainly unrepeatable.

    When I moved to NYC in 1990, I’d go up there all the time—$4.50 for bleachers back then—and it was the same couple-hundred crazy people every game. They all lived in the neighborhood.

    The chants were vile & the hazing of the opponent’s RF was relentless, but occasionally it was really funny. I’d bring friends from Georgia & they were genuinely appalled, but they’d leave laughing. (I still hear “The Manny Ramirez Song” in my sleep.)

    But I quit going out there in the mid-’90s when they quit selling beer. It had gotten way too stupid.

    Tack-on time…

  76. I’m glad to see him putting a good swing on the ball, his bat had gone to sleep of late.

    I know the old saw about how sinkerballers like being tired — hell, I basically relied on a variant of that when I argued that the Braves should sign Derek Lowe as a free agent, because I said that a sinkerballer might be likely to age more gracefully.

    In fairness to me, I was arguing that the Braves should go for Lowe instead of A.J. Burnett, Oliver Perez, Ben Sheets, C.C. Sabathia, and Ryan Dempster, and all but Sabathia and Dempster have utterly fallen apart. So we didn’t get the worst guy on the market. But my argument about why Lowe would be good was pretty bad.

  77. Winnipeg Jets first goal in 15 years.
    Braves up 4-0.
    Cards down 3-0.

    Pretty good night so far.

  78. 1st inning- 2nd and 3rd no outs, 0 runs
    7th inning- bases loaded no outs, 0 runs

    Even winning 4-0 is discouraging.

  79. Oh, he’th fabulouth. Thothe thix inningth he threw againtht Pitthburgh really thold me on the Lithp’th abilitieth. He might get to pitch more important inningth down the thtretch ath Venterth and Kimbrel wear down.

  80. After that swing, I’m no longer so sure, but I think I would be in favor of sitting McCann tomorrow and giving him two days off. He needs something to change. Of course, as I said, as soon I was about to type that he scalded that ball to right.

  81. Wow, McCann is really slow. I know it’s been stated before, but hits to the wall should be doubles instead of singles.

  82. Papelbon was brought in during the 8th inning with 2 on, 1 out, and a 5-4 lead. He struck out the 1st guy then gave up a single to load the bases. He then gives up a 2 out bases clearing double. Sox down 7-4. He’s a douche

  83. This game is kinda maddening. I’m glad we won, but it just makes me angry to think how many innings all year we sunk into absolute no talents like Proctor and Linebrink when we could have been using guys with actual stuff and upside like C-Mart and Varvarro.

  84. I haven’t really wanted to say much, as we have our own problems over here, but there is nothing that isn’t funny about the current Red Sox predicament.

    Particularly ironic is all the stuff about how no team who started as badly as the Red Sox did has ever made the playoffs. They found themselves with the best record in baseball and everyone kind of forgot about it. If they wind up not making the playoffs because of a monumental collapse after all of that, it would be fairly amusing.

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