From last thread:
Anybody else post/notice this yesterday? http://www.ajc.com/braves/content/sports/braves/stories/2009/06/18/smoltz_braves_red_sox.html
Smoltz getting un-bitter. Which I expected/hoped to happen sooner, but I don’t think he was going to be able to let go till he actually knew he could still play and not just wishing he could. I know this will bring out the “John’s a whiner” crowd, but oh well.
One of the dudes that writes for Firebrand did a Q&A for me. This was the last question, I thought it was hilarious:
“Q: What is Papelbon going to destroy at Turner Field if he blows a save?
A: The OBP display when Franceour is batting the next day…”
sansho1
on June 19, 2009 at 2:24 pm
ububba, I was sitting here thinking of memorable Georgia Theatre shows and it struck me — didn’t I see you there fronting The Raymonds once upon a time? Y’all opened for Mercyland IIRC.
Robert
on June 19, 2009 at 2:27 pm
I agree with Mac on wondering why Bobby keeps plugging away. He’s accomplished everything, this team is going nowhere and has more than a few knuckleheads. Why not just hang it up or even “retire” from the Braves and then try to score a gig with a team that actually has a chance?
rehabreject
on June 19, 2009 at 2:28 pm
BREAKING NEWS accordng to MLBTR
Braves are looking for right-handed hitting corner outfielders
Tom
on June 19, 2009 at 2:29 pm
Maybe it’s loyalty.
Seat Painter
on June 19, 2009 at 2:30 pm
So:
Kawakami tonight, Vasquez tomorrow and Lowe on Sunday? Blowout, close loss, close win?
csg
on June 19, 2009 at 2:33 pm
last thread…
“They wouldn’t do Francoeur for Young, but they may do Francoeur and more for Young.”
yeah, but why would we. Young sucks. Trading bad players for bad players is a bad idea, not to mention adding in a prospect or two. Just release Frenchy
While I understand the mentality of “quitting now that he’s done everything”, I also think of two things.
A) How easy is it for anybody to leave a job they’ve done for as long as he’s done that one. And let’s be honest, he manages a baseball team, this is probably a job he enjoys. More than most of us in our jobs, I imagine the “hang out with coworkers who are friends” aspect of his job makes it an enjoyable way to spend the day.
B) He may want the challenge of bringing another team to “being good” when it isn’t highly funded. There may be a personal challenge there that he wants to face. Can he win with a team where the owner isn’t willing/able to go buy the missing pieces. I think we know that he and JS know how to put together a winning team when the money is flowing. He may want to see if they can do the same with some budgetary restrictions. I imagine he likes a challenge.
hankonly
on June 19, 2009 at 2:38 pm
The Ruggles. I think that’s it. I worked with a guy who played bass in what I think was called The Ruggles.
Not the Ruttles (the SNL sendup of the Beatles).
Have no idea where that came from. Not sure I want to know.
Any of you Athenians remember them? Said they opened for the Police one time.
Tiger224
on June 19, 2009 at 2:39 pm
#10
I would add to that…he’s doing a job that he loves, he’s a living legend in ATL…AND he’s making a bunch of money.
And I can’t imagine his job is really all that hard.
A) Ruttles were a Monty Python (or part of them anyway) send up of the Beatles, not SNL I’m pretty sure.
B) yeah tiger… Certainly making a ton of money would be a factor too (though I imagine less of a factor at his age than it would be at the player’s age… at Bobby’s age he’s probably well set for the rest of his life and probably knows it).
csg
on June 19, 2009 at 2:49 pm
Burke over Diory sounds like an upgrade to me
Garrett Anderson
on June 19, 2009 at 2:49 pm
yaaaaaaaaaawnnnn.
mornin everyone, just got up for the game. think ill take it easy today, kinda tired.
rehabreject
on June 19, 2009 at 2:52 pm
@16
tell Bobby you feel a tad lackadaisical and he should put Diaz in
sansho1
on June 19, 2009 at 2:53 pm
hankonly, I remember the name, but I don’t remember ever seeing them. Which is not to say I never saw them.
As for opening for The Police, that would have been quite a coup. I remember Stewart Copeland had a band (post-Police breakup) that played at the now-lamented Georgia Theatre at least once.
Jeffery Francoeur
on June 19, 2009 at 3:07 pm
HEY GUYS! I AM SO PUMPED TO BE IN BOSTON! WHAT A COOL PLACE. I FLEW DELTA HERE! I DRANK A JUICE BOX ON THE PLANE! MR. COX PROMISED TO BUY ME A BRUINS TEE SHIRT! DO YOUTHINK I GET TO SEE BEN AFLECK?! DO YOU THINK TED WILLIAMS WOULD LIKE ME?! MY DAD SAID HE MIGHT COME! DO YOU THINK HE WILL?! GOTTA GO PRACITCE SWINGING AT AIR!
Smitty
on June 19, 2009 at 3:08 pm
This is the start of the last week of baseball for us.
The Rutles were created by Eric Idle of Monty Python (songs by Neil Innes of the Bonzo Dog (Do-Dah) Band) but they appeared on SNL, and the movie (All You Need is Cash) was produced by Lorne Michaels and featured most of the original SNL cast.
Jeffery Francoeur
on June 19, 2009 at 3:23 pm
Caddy smells like trees.
RobBroad4th
on June 19, 2009 at 3:26 pm
I hate the Red Sox. With a captial “hate.” Most annoying fans in baseball (Cubs and Mets fans give them a run for their money though.)
MikeM
on June 19, 2009 at 3:29 pm
I will be attending the Gwinnett game tonight vs. my hometown Louisville Bats. The Braves starter is listed as something called a Todd Redmond. Should I be excited? His minor league stats look decent.
[quoting AAR]Other than Mauer and Morneau, who were awfully damned close to finished products, and Torii Hunter, who’s a phenomenal athlete, they have sucked at bringing along hitters with flaws in their game.[/quote]
So excluding anyone good, they don’t really develop anyone good. Got it. How many MVP caliber hitters do you need to develop to get over the threshold?
I’ve also never seen it written that a high school catcher is a finished product. Learning lots of new stuff today.
Very ouch, dude. But I stand by my statement. Prior to Morneau in ’06, remember, in the entire steroid era, the Twins hadn’t had a 30-hr guy since Gary Gaetti in 1987. They — especially Tom Kelly — were famous for taking power hitters and flattening out their swings. This is what they did to Ortiz.
Also, Joe Mauer wasn’t just “a high school catcher.” He was, if you recall, thought to be one of the best hitters on the planet, when drafted.
It’s not that the Twins can’t develop hitters. It’s that they can’t develop power hitters. Their philosophy was Joe Simpson-style: spray the ball, go the other way, flatten out your swing, don’t uppercut.
I don’t have high hopes for this weekend, but do I ever like to beat this team. C’mon, boys—make us happy.
hank,
Ruggles? Don’t remember hearing about them.
Athens bands have included The Woggles (current garage-rock outfit) and The WUOGerz (1979-80-era band of UGA radio station folk). I’m guessing that you have the name slightly off.
BTW, The Police did play The Georgia Theater when they first started & it’s quite possible that The WUOGerz opened that show. But I don’t know. Would’ve been a year or two before I got there.
sansho,
You are correct, sir. We played there in May, 1990. Our “opening act” was the Ramones film “Rock & Roll High School.”
Mercyland didn’t play that night, but their guitar player broke his elbow doing a stage dive. Very ouch, too.
Ruggles is the name of a dorm at Columbia, as it happens.
Marc Schneider
on June 19, 2009 at 4:16 pm
Ububba,
How are the locals responding to the Yanks losing two to the Nationals? Suicide watch? I believe until these last two games the Yankees had not lost a game in which they gave up three runs or less.
Robert
on June 19, 2009 at 4:16 pm
Also, Joe Mauer wasn’t just “a high school catcher.” He was, if you recall, thought to be one of the best hitters on the planet, when drafted.
I remember Mauer was considered a risky pick (as most high school catchers are) when there was a sure thing, finished product on the board in Mark Prior.
Obviously Ortiz and the Twins did not workout but I don’t think you can make any organization wide judgements based off that one case. Especially since there’s a better than average chance there were some – let’s say – outside influences that led to David Ortiz becoming Big Poppi in Boston.
The Twins developed guys like Corey Koskie and Jacque Jones who were good for 25 HR in their good years. Add in Mauer, Morneau, Hunter, the Twins are doing ok in getting power from the minor leagues. Certainly better than we are.
Nevin
on June 19, 2009 at 4:42 pm
Mac,
Is there still a link here somewhere to Amazon, whereby if we follow it to purchase something, you get a bit of shrapnel (loose change)?
If so, can you point it out again? Gonna make a purchase.
I guess that’s about as decent a lineup as we can muster tonight. Maybe Frenchy can hit a pop fly to left. It only has to go 315 feet.
Marc,
Yankee fans are not doing tap-dances, that’s for sure.
Just an odd couple of days, really. They score a million runs off Santana on Sunday & have a comeback win Monday night—then they go into hibernation, which I didn’t think was possible in that stadium.
Tuesday’s game was against Lannan, this lefty kid from Long Beach, L.I., who grew up a big Yankee fan, so there was a little intrigue there. I think some of the fans didn’t mind losing to him.
The end of that game was pretty exciting because the kid was up 3-1 and had a 2-hitter going into the 9th. He gives up a HR to Damon, gets an out, then gives up a single. Acta pulls him, but closer tries to muck things up. Runners on the corners, one out.
You could see Lannan on the top step of the dugout, sweating out every pitch, until Cano (the team’s hottest hitter) hits into a tailor-made DP to end it.
Last night’s game had a 5+ hour rain delay (in a game that couldn’t be made up). I don’t think anybody wanted to be there, including the Yankees. BTW, it was the first game all season that the stadium didn’t have a HR.
Ethan
on June 19, 2009 at 5:14 pm
Just signed Chris Burke. Sent him to AAA. Abstractly, I guess it’s decent move, but that Astros playoff game still pisses me off and he’s the main reason why.
32,
How are either of them supposed to be productive at the plate? Why are they in the line-up? I’d play Blanco in left, Diaz in right, ACHE DHing (his only position at Fenway, and way down in the order) and Prado at 2B. But hey, what do I know, I just use common sense and numbers. “Baseball people” defend their decisions all the time by saying “we’re baseball people”. Newsflash: baseball people can be wrong. And Bobby is wrong tonight. It’s so embarrassing we’re running groundhog “out” there against the Red Sox and a national audience. I really wish Bobby Cox wouldn’t do that.
Robert: Koskie hit more than 15 homers exactly twice in his career: 26 in 2001, and 25 in 2004. Jacque Jones hit 20 4 times, in 2002 and 2004-2006. Michael Cuddyer hit 24 in 2006. Hunter had 6 seasons with at least 20, and he finally hit 31 in 2006. Other than Morneau, these are the cream of their slugging crop.
Meanwhile, between 1987 and 2006, here are all the homegrown Braves who hit at least 30 homers in a season:
Dale Murphy (max: 44)
Ron Gant
David Justice (max: 40)
Chipper Jones (max: 45)
Javy Lopez
Ryan Klesko
Andruw Jones (max: 51)
Adam LaRoche
We also signed or traded for sluggers like Fred McGriff, Andres Galarraga (max: 44), J.D. Drew, Gary Sheffield, and Mark Teixeira, all of whom hit at least 30 homers in a Braves uniform.
By contrast, in 1999 and 2000, the Twins didn’t have a single guy hit as many as 20 home runs. They haven’t had a 40-homer guy since Killebrew in the ’60s.
They’re not an organization that has tended to emphasize power over the last two-plus decades. This isn’t really a controversial statement. I’m not really sure why you disagree.
KJ’s been awful, but if we’re going to be any good at all he’s just gotta play better. Play him and hope for the best. It’s not like he’s never had any success.
Now if we could only get someone to do that tiring hitting and baserunning for him, we’d be all set.
Fixed.
Robert
on June 19, 2009 at 5:41 pm
Meanwhile, between 1987 and 2006,
I like how you went back to ’87 so you could catch Murphy’s big year. I guess were talking different things. It’s true if you stretch back to the early nineties when our farm system was fully functional there is plenty to like. That’s seems like another lifetime to me since we’ve been playing with voids at the corner power spots for a good while.
Nathan
on June 19, 2009 at 5:49 pm
Robert,
I think he went back to 1987 because that was the last time (before 2006 Morneau) that the Twins had a 30-HR hitter (Gary Gaetti).
Joshua
on June 19, 2009 at 6:05 pm
I agree that KJ has been awful. But I do think that if we have any chance of succeeding, it has to be with him. With this teams lack of power, adding Prado to the mix would only compound that. At least KJ can be a power threat when he is right.
braves14
on June 19, 2009 at 6:08 pm
Prado should be playing everyday now somewhere for us, preferably in an outfield corner.
urlhix
on June 19, 2009 at 6:12 pm
Wow, go Nate!
Ethan
on June 19, 2009 at 6:13 pm
Nate the Great!
Nathan
on June 19, 2009 at 6:14 pm
Nice to see Chipper with an XBH.
EDIT: And Gameday has Matsuzaka topping out at all of 91 mph. He just might not have it today.
oldtimer?
on June 19, 2009 at 6:15 pm
I like that both teams are wearing their BP jerseys.
Ethan
on June 19, 2009 at 6:20 pm
I love this
oldtimer?
on June 19, 2009 at 6:21 pm
If we only get 2 out of this I am going to be PO’d
Nathan
on June 19, 2009 at 6:22 pm
Yuck.
Tom
on June 19, 2009 at 6:22 pm
Gotta love this team.
oldtimer?
on June 19, 2009 at 6:23 pm
HATE.
Our New Insect Overlords
on June 19, 2009 at 6:24 pm
The way this year is going, we’ll lose the lead in the bottom of the first, and that will be that.
ryan c
on June 19, 2009 at 6:24 pm
we have bad luck, and diaz looked like he wanted to play hero, which is probably hard not to do with the bases loaded in front of the biggest crowd he will play in front of this year.
'Rissa
on June 19, 2009 at 6:29 pm
It’s weird for the team to score a couple of runs in an inning yet leave me very dissatisfied. Don’t take too much advantage of an opportunity like that, guys.
Mike
on June 19, 2009 at 6:30 pm
Diaz and Kotchman did their impersonation of Johnson and Francoeur in that situation. If Kotchman’s double-play ball had been a weak dribbler, it would have been perfect!
It’s uncanny how often the Braves shoot blanks when they have a chance to blow something open. We’ve got to have one of the most un-clutch offenses ever.
urlhix
on June 19, 2009 at 6:32 pm
KK looking sharp.
Nathan
on June 19, 2009 at 6:37 pm
Gameday had that pitch to KJ as right down the pipe at 90 mph. And he didn’t even get a deep fly ball.
Phillies losing 4-2 in the 6th
Mets winning 4-0 in the 6th
Marlins losing 5-1 in the 5th
c. shorter
on June 19, 2009 at 7:47 pm
Where did this offense come from?
Ethan
on June 19, 2009 at 7:50 pm
What % of the runs that we’ll score for then entire series did we score tonight?
Jeff M.
on June 19, 2009 at 7:52 pm
braves14 (@86),
Don’t do this to yourself. It’s still June and the Braves Swoon isn’t over yet. Scoreboard watching will only beget suffering for you. It’s best just to look for one positive thing in each game and be satisfied. I learned this watching the Braves in the 80s.
urlhix
on June 19, 2009 at 8:01 pm
Esco’s arm has been off target tonight. That’s the third ball he’s thrown that’s been off line.
Ethan
on June 19, 2009 at 8:03 pm
Jason Bay is a manbearpig
sansho1
on June 19, 2009 at 8:05 pm
Are you completely serial?
csg
on June 19, 2009 at 8:07 pm
we need more runs, I think
Jon K
on June 19, 2009 at 8:09 pm
outta boy chip! always playing hard
braves14
on June 19, 2009 at 8:15 pm
Francoeur sucks.
Jon K
on June 19, 2009 at 8:16 pm
francoeur blows
urlhix
on June 19, 2009 at 8:17 pm
Yeah, that was weak.
csg
on June 19, 2009 at 8:19 pm
why take out Kawakami? I dont think he was even to 90 pitches and only given up 2 hits
you can pretty much guarantee that Soriano and Gonzo pitch with a 5 run lead
Ethan
on June 19, 2009 at 8:19 pm
If Soriano/Gonzalez pitch today with more than a 4 run differential, I’ll be pissed and it will be classic Bobby bullshit bullpen handling.
braves14
on June 19, 2009 at 8:21 pm
Maybe KK told Bobby he was gassed. Dunno.
Soriano/Gonzo will pitch tonight and will be fatigued when needed tomorrow in a close game for the 3rd day in a row. Count it.
sdp
on June 19, 2009 at 8:34 pm
Gotta audition Soriano and Gonzalez for when the Braves are 10 games out next Friday.
Ethan
on June 19, 2009 at 8:34 pm
What.The.Hell
EDIT: Seriously. This is fucking ridiculous. We’re up 5. These guys cannot pitch every day.
This is another situation where you put Medlen in for the last 2 or 3 innings. I seriously don’t understand it. Soriano is now on pace now for over 75 IP and we’ve been playing shitty. If we ever get to where we’re winning games, that workload will only go up.
I love Bobby, but this just stupidity
Parish
on June 19, 2009 at 8:35 pm
Bobby really kills me with his bullpen usage.
Jon K
on June 19, 2009 at 8:37 pm
Soriano is such an animal
joelk
on June 19, 2009 at 8:38 pm
Wow, Soriano has been absolutely dominant the past couple of outings!
Can someone remind me why Soriano isn’t our closer?
c. shorter
on June 19, 2009 at 8:42 pm
If we’re anywhere near in the hunt at the end of August, we’re going to have to rely on Acosta and Parr. The best bullpen arms just can’t keep this up all year.
Also, we have 1 off day until the all-star game. One.
It’s funny, last year the Chiefs had a guy on the staff whose only job was to manage the clock in critical time situations because Herm Edwards was too stupid to do it.
We should get the something similar for Bobby and the bullpen. I swear…if Gonzalez pitches the ninth, there will be an act of violence on my part.
EDIT: You would hope a six run lead would bludgeon it through Bobby’s head
c. shorter
on June 19, 2009 at 8:49 pm
109 — I was expecting ridulousness, but when he said Chipper is a young 37 because he hunts, I just had to stop. Is he running down deer or something?
Frank
on June 19, 2009 at 8:50 pm
I’m guessing the mlb office will have someone asking ACHE to pee in a cup after the game he’s had.
urlhix
on June 19, 2009 at 8:51 pm
The Braves should do the exact opposite of whatever Furman Bisher recommends, as a rule.
Well, tomorrow is probably going to be an off-day. And frankly, what are the odds we’re going to have a lead late against Beckett, even if they do play?
Parish
on June 19, 2009 at 8:56 pm
Joe Simpson making a lot more sense than Bobby Cox.
Ethan
on June 19, 2009 at 8:56 pm
ARE.YOU.KIDDING.ME?
braves14
on June 19, 2009 at 8:56 pm
Even Chip and Joe are befuddled at Bobby’s bullpen management.
Oh, and Bisher’s just trying to get attention.
sdp
on June 19, 2009 at 8:56 pm
Bobby must want a damn win. Jesus Christ. Moylan-Soriano-Gonzalez.
sdp
on June 19, 2009 at 8:58 pm
The Bisher Rule: whatever Furman Bisher says, do exactly the opposite.
Parish
on June 19, 2009 at 9:00 pm
At least, Moylan is not actually one of the top 3 arms in the pen.
I thought he went. No appeal?
oldtimer?
on June 19, 2009 at 9:00 pm
Crap, that was some pitch to end the game.
Parish
on June 19, 2009 at 9:01 pm
He went that time.
I felt it in Suwanee.
Ethan
on June 19, 2009 at 9:03 pm
You don’t pitch your closer for his third straight day with a 6 run lead. Could this even be conceivably be argued? Also, we’ve got five more games vs these guys…why?
sdp
on June 19, 2009 at 9:04 pm
Braves win… and they’re done scoring until July.
spike (back in the ATL)
on June 19, 2009 at 9:06 pm
Bish is the journalistic equivalent to Abe Simpson. Tolerated, beloved by some, but really not who you’d turn to for advice.
braves14
on June 19, 2009 at 9:08 pm
I miss FJM. They’d have a lot of fun with Bisher this week.
Use code “Journal” for a 5% discount.
Good honest interview, Mac.
From last thread:
Anybody else post/notice this yesterday?
http://www.ajc.com/braves/content/sports/braves/stories/2009/06/18/smoltz_braves_red_sox.html
Smoltz getting un-bitter. Which I expected/hoped to happen sooner, but I don’t think he was going to be able to let go till he actually knew he could still play and not just wishing he could. I know this will bring out the “John’s a whiner” crowd, but oh well.
Also didn’t know he had gotten remarried
One of the dudes that writes for Firebrand did a Q&A for me. This was the last question, I thought it was hilarious:
“Q: What is Papelbon going to destroy at Turner Field if he blows a save?
A: The OBP display when Franceour is batting the next day…”
ububba, I was sitting here thinking of memorable Georgia Theatre shows and it struck me — didn’t I see you there fronting The Raymonds once upon a time? Y’all opened for Mercyland IIRC.
I agree with Mac on wondering why Bobby keeps plugging away. He’s accomplished everything, this team is going nowhere and has more than a few knuckleheads. Why not just hang it up or even “retire” from the Braves and then try to score a gig with a team that actually has a chance?
BREAKING NEWS accordng to MLBTR
Braves are looking for right-handed hitting corner outfielders
Maybe it’s loyalty.
So:
Kawakami tonight, Vasquez tomorrow and Lowe on Sunday? Blowout, close loss, close win?
last thread…
“They wouldn’t do Francoeur for Young, but they may do Francoeur and more for Young.”
yeah, but why would we. Young sucks. Trading bad players for bad players is a bad idea, not to mention adding in a prospect or two. Just release Frenchy
While I understand the mentality of “quitting now that he’s done everything”, I also think of two things.
A) How easy is it for anybody to leave a job they’ve done for as long as he’s done that one. And let’s be honest, he manages a baseball team, this is probably a job he enjoys. More than most of us in our jobs, I imagine the “hang out with coworkers who are friends” aspect of his job makes it an enjoyable way to spend the day.
B) He may want the challenge of bringing another team to “being good” when it isn’t highly funded. There may be a personal challenge there that he wants to face. Can he win with a team where the owner isn’t willing/able to go buy the missing pieces. I think we know that he and JS know how to put together a winning team when the money is flowing. He may want to see if they can do the same with some budgetary restrictions. I imagine he likes a challenge.
The Ruggles. I think that’s it. I worked with a guy who played bass in what I think was called The Ruggles.
Not the Ruttles (the SNL sendup of the Beatles).
Have no idea where that came from. Not sure I want to know.
Any of you Athenians remember them? Said they opened for the Police one time.
#10
I would add to that…he’s doing a job that he loves, he’s a living legend in ATL…AND he’s making a bunch of money.
And I can’t imagine his job is really all that hard.
Sign me up, man.
if the Braves are ever in an 18 inning post-season game again, they got that game on lockdown:
http://www.talkingchop.com/2009/6/19/918098/braves-sign-ss-chris-burke
A) Ruttles were a Monty Python (or part of them anyway) send up of the Beatles, not SNL I’m pretty sure.
B) yeah tiger… Certainly making a ton of money would be a factor too (though I imagine less of a factor at his age than it would be at the player’s age… at Bobby’s age he’s probably well set for the rest of his life and probably knows it).
Burke over Diory sounds like an upgrade to me
yaaaaaaaaaawnnnn.
mornin everyone, just got up for the game. think ill take it easy today, kinda tired.
@16
tell Bobby you feel a tad lackadaisical and he should put Diaz in
hankonly, I remember the name, but I don’t remember ever seeing them. Which is not to say I never saw them.
As for opening for The Police, that would have been quite a coup. I remember Stewart Copeland had a band (post-Police breakup) that played at the now-lamented Georgia Theatre at least once.
HEY GUYS! I AM SO PUMPED TO BE IN BOSTON! WHAT A COOL PLACE. I FLEW DELTA HERE! I DRANK A JUICE BOX ON THE PLANE! MR. COX PROMISED TO BUY ME A BRUINS TEE SHIRT! DO YOUTHINK I GET TO SEE BEN AFLECK?! DO YOU THINK TED WILLIAMS WOULD LIKE ME?! MY DAD SAID HE MIGHT COME! DO YOU THINK HE WILL?! GOTTA GO PRACITCE SWINGING AT AIR!
This is the start of the last week of baseball for us.
The Rutles were created by Eric Idle of Monty Python (songs by Neil Innes of the Bonzo Dog (Do-Dah) Band) but they appeared on SNL, and the movie (All You Need is Cash) was produced by Lorne Michaels and featured most of the original SNL cast.
Caddy smells like trees.
I hate the Red Sox. With a captial “hate.” Most annoying fans in baseball (Cubs and Mets fans give them a run for their money though.)
I will be attending the Gwinnett game tonight vs. my hometown Louisville Bats. The Braves starter is listed as something called a Todd Redmond. Should I be excited? His minor league stats look decent.
From the last thread —
Robert Says:
[quoting AAR]Other than Mauer and Morneau, who were awfully damned close to finished products, and Torii Hunter, who’s a phenomenal athlete, they have sucked at bringing along hitters with flaws in their game.[/quote]
So excluding anyone good, they don’t really develop anyone good. Got it. How many MVP caliber hitters do you need to develop to get over the threshold?
I’ve also never seen it written that a high school catcher is a finished product. Learning lots of new stuff today.
Very ouch, dude. But I stand by my statement. Prior to Morneau in ’06, remember, in the entire steroid era, the Twins hadn’t had a 30-hr guy since Gary Gaetti in 1987. They — especially Tom Kelly — were famous for taking power hitters and flattening out their swings. This is what they did to Ortiz.
Also, Joe Mauer wasn’t just “a high school catcher.” He was, if you recall, thought to be one of the best hitters on the planet, when drafted.
It’s not that the Twins can’t develop hitters. It’s that they can’t develop power hitters. Their philosophy was Joe Simpson-style: spray the ball, go the other way, flatten out your swing, don’t uppercut.
I don’t have high hopes for this weekend, but do I ever like to beat this team. C’mon, boys—make us happy.
hank,
Ruggles? Don’t remember hearing about them.
Athens bands have included The Woggles (current garage-rock outfit) and The WUOGerz (1979-80-era band of UGA radio station folk). I’m guessing that you have the name slightly off.
BTW, The Police did play The Georgia Theater when they first started & it’s quite possible that The WUOGerz opened that show. But I don’t know. Would’ve been a year or two before I got there.
sansho,
You are correct, sir. We played there in May, 1990. Our “opening act” was the Ramones film “Rock & Roll High School.”
Mercyland didn’t play that night, but their guitar player broke his elbow doing a stage dive. Very ouch, too.
Ruggles is the name of a dorm at Columbia, as it happens.
Ububba,
How are the locals responding to the Yanks losing two to the Nationals? Suicide watch? I believe until these last two games the Yankees had not lost a game in which they gave up three runs or less.
Also, Joe Mauer wasn’t just “a high school catcher.” He was, if you recall, thought to be one of the best hitters on the planet, when drafted.
I remember Mauer was considered a risky pick (as most high school catchers are) when there was a sure thing, finished product on the board in Mark Prior.
Obviously Ortiz and the Twins did not workout but I don’t think you can make any organization wide judgements based off that one case. Especially since there’s a better than average chance there were some – let’s say – outside influences that led to David Ortiz becoming Big Poppi in Boston.
The Twins developed guys like Corey Koskie and Jacque Jones who were good for 25 HR in their good years. Add in Mauer, Morneau, Hunter, the Twins are doing ok in getting power from the minor leagues. Certainly better than we are.
Mac,
Is there still a link here somewhere to Amazon, whereby if we follow it to purchase something, you get a bit of shrapnel (loose change)?
If so, can you point it out again? Gonna make a purchase.
-Nevin
per FoxSports
McLouth
Yunel
Chip
Mac
ACHE – DH
Diaz
Kotchman
Frenchy
KJ
How is Frenchy supposed to get anything to hit in front of KJ?
i hate bobby cox for that shit. why cant he ride a hot lineup? instead, he goes back to the shit that hasnt worked all year.
Thanks, I put an Amazon search box on the right sidebar.
I guess that’s about as decent a lineup as we can muster tonight. Maybe Frenchy can hit a pop fly to left. It only has to go 315 feet.
Marc,
Yankee fans are not doing tap-dances, that’s for sure.
Just an odd couple of days, really. They score a million runs off Santana on Sunday & have a comeback win Monday night—then they go into hibernation, which I didn’t think was possible in that stadium.
Tuesday’s game was against Lannan, this lefty kid from Long Beach, L.I., who grew up a big Yankee fan, so there was a little intrigue there. I think some of the fans didn’t mind losing to him.
The end of that game was pretty exciting because the kid was up 3-1 and had a 2-hitter going into the 9th. He gives up a HR to Damon, gets an out, then gives up a single. Acta pulls him, but closer tries to muck things up. Runners on the corners, one out.
You could see Lannan on the top step of the dugout, sweating out every pitch, until Cano (the team’s hottest hitter) hits into a tailor-made DP to end it.
Last night’s game had a 5+ hour rain delay (in a game that couldn’t be made up). I don’t think anybody wanted to be there, including the Yankees. BTW, it was the first game all season that the stadium didn’t have a HR.
Just signed Chris Burke. Sent him to AAA. Abstractly, I guess it’s decent move, but that Astros playoff game still pisses me off and he’s the main reason why.
32,
How are either of them supposed to be productive at the plate? Why are they in the line-up? I’d play Blanco in left, Diaz in right, ACHE DHing (his only position at Fenway, and way down in the order) and Prado at 2B. But hey, what do I know, I just use common sense and numbers. “Baseball people” defend their decisions all the time by saying “we’re baseball people”. Newsflash: baseball people can be wrong. And Bobby is wrong tonight. It’s so embarrassing we’re running groundhog “out” there against the Red Sox and a national audience. I really wish Bobby Cox wouldn’t do that.
Like that little pun?
Robert: Koskie hit more than 15 homers exactly twice in his career: 26 in 2001, and 25 in 2004. Jacque Jones hit 20 4 times, in 2002 and 2004-2006. Michael Cuddyer hit 24 in 2006. Hunter had 6 seasons with at least 20, and he finally hit 31 in 2006. Other than Morneau, these are the cream of their slugging crop.
Meanwhile, between 1987 and 2006, here are all the homegrown Braves who hit at least 30 homers in a season:
Dale Murphy (max: 44)
Ron Gant
David Justice (max: 40)
Chipper Jones (max: 45)
Javy Lopez
Ryan Klesko
Andruw Jones (max: 51)
Adam LaRoche
We also signed or traded for sluggers like Fred McGriff, Andres Galarraga (max: 44), J.D. Drew, Gary Sheffield, and Mark Teixeira, all of whom hit at least 30 homers in a Braves uniform.
By contrast, in 1999 and 2000, the Twins didn’t have a single guy hit as many as 20 home runs. They haven’t had a 40-homer guy since Killebrew in the ’60s.
They’re not an organization that has tended to emphasize power over the last two-plus decades. This isn’t really a controversial statement. I’m not really sure why you disagree.
And DHing is made for ACHE. Now if he could only get someone to do that tiring hitting and baserunning for him, he’d be all set.
KJ’s been awful, but if we’re going to be any good at all he’s just gotta play better. Play him and hope for the best. It’s not like he’s never had any success.
KJ’s no Mazeroski, but Prado is a disaster at 2B.
Now if we could only get someone to do that tiring hitting and baserunning for him, we’d be all set.
Fixed.
Meanwhile, between 1987 and 2006,
I like how you went back to ’87 so you could catch Murphy’s big year. I guess were talking different things. It’s true if you stretch back to the early nineties when our farm system was fully functional there is plenty to like. That’s seems like another lifetime to me since we’ve been playing with voids at the corner power spots for a good while.
Robert,
I think he went back to 1987 because that was the last time (before 2006 Morneau) that the Twins had a 30-HR hitter (Gary Gaetti).
I agree that KJ has been awful. But I do think that if we have any chance of succeeding, it has to be with him. With this teams lack of power, adding Prado to the mix would only compound that. At least KJ can be a power threat when he is right.
Prado should be playing everyday now somewhere for us, preferably in an outfield corner.
Wow, go Nate!
Nate the Great!
Nice to see Chipper with an XBH.
EDIT: And Gameday has Matsuzaka topping out at all of 91 mph. He just might not have it today.
I like that both teams are wearing their BP jerseys.
I love this
If we only get 2 out of this I am going to be PO’d
Yuck.
Gotta love this team.
HATE.
The way this year is going, we’ll lose the lead in the bottom of the first, and that will be that.
we have bad luck, and diaz looked like he wanted to play hero, which is probably hard not to do with the bases loaded in front of the biggest crowd he will play in front of this year.
It’s weird for the team to score a couple of runs in an inning yet leave me very dissatisfied. Don’t take too much advantage of an opportunity like that, guys.
Diaz and Kotchman did their impersonation of Johnson and Francoeur in that situation. If Kotchman’s double-play ball had been a weak dribbler, it would have been perfect!
It’s uncanny how often the Braves shoot blanks when they have a chance to blow something open. We’ve got to have one of the most un-clutch offenses ever.
KK looking sharp.
Gameday had that pitch to KJ as right down the pipe at 90 mph. And he didn’t even get a deep fly ball.
The ball just dies off of KJ’s bat, just like it did the Groundhog’s last year.
KK’s into the K’s.
Why wasn’t the fan ejected?
KK is hitting 93 on the gun.
Wow…Gameday says the second pitch to Ellsbury was basically just off of center of the strikezone. Was it really that good, and still a ball?
If he keeps pitching like this, can we start calling him Shredder?
65 — Yes. McCann was crossed up and played it off his chest for a “wild pitch.” The umpire was apparently fooled as well. No harm done, though.
Mac,
What happened?
Ground-rule double on a hit down the line; fan leaned over and touched the ball.
Also, Diaz was there in time to cut it off for a single, but they gave the batter second anyway. Way to discourage fan interference, guys.
ACHE, ACHE, ACHE…
Nick Green…I remember the time he hit that walk-off 3 run homer against the Red Sox in extra innings in 04. I was at that game, that was nice.
For anyone who knows,
Have KK and Dice-K ever met up in a match-up in Japan? If so, how did each fare?
There’s Kotchman with his warning track power. Damn, he’s just Doug Mientkiewicz redux.
McLouth!
Escobar!
I think Drew and Anderson should have a lackadaisical-off.
before long Derek Lowe might have the worst era of all the starting staff
I think Ortiz has Francoeur-disease.
I heard it isnt curable.
Nope, its not. Kind of like rabies. Just have to put them down.
ACHE! That might get his OBP above .300.
Robert Redford: These guys aren’t so tough.
Paul Newman: Neither are we.
KENSHIN REIGNS SUPREME OVER DICE-K
incredible catch.
How did ACHE make it to 3rd?
Diaz sac fly to RF.
Phillies losing 4-2 in the 6th
Mets winning 4-0 in the 6th
Marlins losing 5-1 in the 5th
Where did this offense come from?
What % of the runs that we’ll score for then entire series did we score tonight?
braves14 (@86),
Don’t do this to yourself. It’s still June and the Braves Swoon isn’t over yet. Scoreboard watching will only beget suffering for you. It’s best just to look for one positive thing in each game and be satisfied. I learned this watching the Braves in the 80s.
Esco’s arm has been off target tonight. That’s the third ball he’s thrown that’s been off line.
Jason Bay is a manbearpig
Are you completely serial?
we need more runs, I think
outta boy chip! always playing hard
Francoeur sucks.
francoeur blows
Yeah, that was weak.
why take out Kawakami? I dont think he was even to 90 pitches and only given up 2 hits
you can pretty much guarantee that Soriano and Gonzo pitch with a 5 run lead
If Soriano/Gonzalez pitch today with more than a 4 run differential, I’ll be pissed and it will be classic Bobby bullshit bullpen handling.
Maybe KK told Bobby he was gassed. Dunno.
Soriano/Gonzo will pitch tonight and will be fatigued when needed tomorrow in a close game for the 3rd day in a row. Count it.
Gotta audition Soriano and Gonzalez for when the Braves are 10 games out next Friday.
What.The.Hell
EDIT: Seriously. This is fucking ridiculous. We’re up 5. These guys cannot pitch every day.
This is another situation where you put Medlen in for the last 2 or 3 innings. I seriously don’t understand it. Soriano is now on pace now for over 75 IP and we’ve been playing shitty. If we ever get to where we’re winning games, that workload will only go up.
I love Bobby, but this just stupidity
Bobby really kills me with his bullpen usage.
Soriano is such an animal
Wow, Soriano has been absolutely dominant the past couple of outings!
Theo Epstein just popped a woody.
Can someone remind me why Soriano isn’t our closer?
If we’re anywhere near in the hunt at the end of August, we’re going to have to rely on Acosta and Parr. The best bullpen arms just can’t keep this up all year.
LOL, Furman Bitcher is back at it:
Brace yourselves, but Braves should put Chipper on the market
So, all in one week, he’s wanted the Braves to be more patient with Francoeur, the local boy putting asses in seats, and then he wants to trade an MVP, batting champ, and one of the best switch hitters to ever play the game AFTER he signed an extension to finish his career in Atlanta.
Whew.
Amazing.
Also, we have 1 off day until the all-star game. One.
It’s funny, last year the Chiefs had a guy on the staff whose only job was to manage the clock in critical time situations because Herm Edwards was too stupid to do it.
We should get the something similar for Bobby and the bullpen. I swear…if Gonzalez pitches the ninth, there will be an act of violence on my part.
EDIT: You would hope a six run lead would bludgeon it through Bobby’s head
109 — I was expecting ridulousness, but when he said Chipper is a young 37 because he hunts, I just had to stop. Is he running down deer or something?
I’m guessing the mlb office will have someone asking ACHE to pee in a cup after the game he’s had.
The Braves should do the exact opposite of whatever Furman Bisher recommends, as a rule.
112,
If he tested positive that’d save us $770,000. Would him failing a drug test be the worst thing that ever happened to our club?
gonzo wednesday in a game down 3-2, yesterday in a 7 run lead game, tonight in a 6 run lead game
this really is ridiculous
Well, tomorrow is probably going to be an off-day. And frankly, what are the odds we’re going to have a lead late against Beckett, even if they do play?
Joe Simpson making a lot more sense than Bobby Cox.
ARE.YOU.KIDDING.ME?
Even Chip and Joe are befuddled at Bobby’s bullpen management.
Oh, and Bisher’s just trying to get attention.
Bobby must want a damn win. Jesus Christ. Moylan-Soriano-Gonzalez.
The Bisher Rule: whatever Furman Bisher says, do exactly the opposite.
At least, Moylan is not actually one of the top 3 arms in the pen.
I thought he went. No appeal?
Crap, that was some pitch to end the game.
He went that time.
I felt it in Suwanee.
You don’t pitch your closer for his third straight day with a 6 run lead. Could this even be conceivably be argued? Also, we’ve got five more games vs these guys…why?
Braves win… and they’re done scoring until July.
Bish is the journalistic equivalent to Abe Simpson. Tolerated, beloved by some, but really not who you’d turn to for advice.
I miss FJM. They’d have a lot of fun with Bisher this week.
Recap is up.