I suppose you can talk about the baseball game if you want. Hey, look, kittie!
Again, I will eventually recap this game but probably not until the morning.
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I suppose you can talk about the baseball game if you want. Hey, look, kittie!
Again, I will eventually recap this game but probably not until the morning.
Use code “Journal” for a 5% discount.
Mac,
The VANDY/Bama line is down to +3.
Re: the poll, I can’t blame JS very much. More pitching would be nice, but with the budget he has, I’m not sure what else he could have done. We knew Gonzalez was a risk, but it was a worthwhile risk.
Stu: What’s the line on USC-UGA?
If you assume that: (1) The Braves will not play in the 2007 postseason; (2) Andruw will not return to the Braves; (3) Hampton will contribute little or nothing in 2008; but (4) payroll will increase to $100 million in 2008, what do you do in 2008?
Keeping McCann, Escobar, and Johnson, with Frenchy moving to center, provides an up-the-middle core. There are some kids on the farm like Lillibridge and Brandon Jones who, if not ready, are close; and our relievers are probably as good as any in the NL. However, the Braves will not win in 2008 unless they improve their rotation.
Our starting pitching is abysmal this year and doesn’t promise to be better next year. Furthermore, there are no free agent pitchers available who can head the rotation. Smoltz will be another year older, and Chipper will be lucky to play as many games next year as he did this year.
Chipper, Smoltz, Hudson, Renteria, and Tex still have value. The first two might be willing to accept a trade to a contender if they understand the Braves are going to rebuild, and the final three don’t get a vote as to whether they stay or go.
Let’s blow up the Braves and go young.
yuck! Never again suggest that Chipper or Smoltz be traded! Gross!
Andy,
UGA is currently a 6.5-point favorite.
Coop,
Get realistic. If JS & Bobby are sticking around for one more year, they aren’t going to blow up this team. Just not happening.
I saw UGA -6 vs. USC this morning.
I’ll take Carolina at -6.5.
I don’t see a need to blow up the team. The Braves are already pretty young, except for Chipper and Smoltz.
Ububba:
You’re right, of course; so how do you fix the Braves so they can win in 2008?
The odds of the Braves trading Chipper OR Smoltz are ZERO. They can both veto a trade to any team and would certainly do it. The odds of trading them both is some number less than zero.
We have a good core of players for the next 5-10 years, and more waiting in the minors. We need starting pitching, that’s it.
JS has to go into 2008 and not rely on Carlyle, Cormier, or Hampton working out. If they happen to dazzle in spring training, great. But no more experiments.
All the team really needs is a solid #2 or #3 starting pitcher to go behind Smoltz and Hudson but ahead of James and Cormier/Reyes/Hampton. Shuerholz should be able to find that in free agency or perhaps via trade without too much problem assuming reports of the increased payroll are accurate. A better bench would help too, but that can be taken care of pretty easily by simply not signing other teams’ castoffs (see: Woodward, Wilson, Miller, and Sturtze). With young relievers such as Devine and Acosta backing up Moylan, Gonzalez, and Soriano the bullpen could be among the best the Braves have had.
I really hope that the Edgar Renteria for Jon Garland talks heat up again in the offseason.
I’m totally in college football mode (once again wasting a full month of Extra Innings and MLBTV), but saying the team is all set except for starting pitching is like saying that your football team looks great except at quarterback. Well, that’s the hard part.
The last two college football games called by the team on Thom Brenneman and Charles Davis have been Boise State-Oklahoma and App State-Michigan. What are the odds? The rest of their careers are going to be a letdown.
Glavine has a player option for 2008 w/ the Mets. Any talk about if he’d come back? Would you welcome him back? Do you think he would be a valued addition (not exactly the same question)?
“Let’s blow up the Braves and go young.”
Hell no. All the Braves need to do is improve their starting rotation this offseason and they’ll be set to contend just fine in 2008.
http://theauburner.com/mark_comickstate.html
Have a cartoon.
Jonathan, Glavine’s a pretty tricky subject around here — strong emotions all around. Personally, I’ve always liked him, but after watching him go to the Mets in two straight free agencies, I’m not holding my breath that we’d be able to get him on the third. And he’s not very good any more.
The Braves have a very solid offensive core, and can probably stay minimally competitive for another year or two with these guys, but JS, Bobby, and John Smoltz will all retire in the next two years or so (and Chipper won’t be long behind) and after that, it’ll probably be time to blow up and go young.
Wryn, I’m not sure you’ve posted even one cartoon comic that turned out to be even mildly funny yet.
How about Torii Hunter?
As far as Hunter’s next team, Ken Rosenthal has speculated on the Yankees, Phillies, Braves, Padres, Rockies, Giants, White Sox, and Rangers.
http://www.mlbtraderumors.com/2007/09/torii-hunter-tu.html#trackback
I loved the Auburn cartoon. It shows a level of delusion I wasn’t sure that even Aubies were capable of.
They won that game because, for some reason, K-State (with a lead late in the game) decided to pressure the Auburn punter & roughed him, giving Auburn new life.
I loved Auburn’s defense in the game, but they know better than anyone that they have some work to do on the other side of the ball.
Coop,
Lots of things need to be done. The first issue, as many have mentioned here, is the rotation. If that means trading Renteria for a real starter (even a one-year guy), then I’m fine with it.
We’ll obviously have to replace Andruw. But I’m not so worried about the offense or even the bullpen, if Soriano & Gonzo can pitch next year. I’m worried about putting out 5 starters who offer a semblance of a chance of winning a ball game. Too often this year we didn’t have that.
#18, why spend $16+ million a year on Tori Hunter when you can instead spend it on a real need such as a #3 starting pitcher and just use Francoeur, Diaz, and either Brandon Jones or Brent Lillibridge?
Ron, you’re right.
Brandon Jones isn’t a CF. I’m not sold on the idea of Lillibridge or Francoeur in center either.
Wouldn’t surprise me to see the Braves make a run at Mike Cameron.
@19
ububba, i fail to see how auburn fans are delusional, auburn won the game. yes for the better part 56 minutes we were getting out played, but due to a mental collapse by KSU, act of god or superior play in the final 4 minutes auburn won the first game on it’s schedule. it won with an inexperienced offensive line, a couple of second string RBs, an almost entirely new special teams unit whose kickers are either true or redshirt freshman, and most of all a QB who has a weak arm, is slow and kept calling the wrong protection at the line. i’d say that is reason to be happy…winning that is.
South Florida is coming to town this week and they’ll likely hand us are ass twice as fast as KSU, but i still wouldn’t count out these lowly, and pathetic tigers.
War Eagle!
Fact remains that AU was extremely lucky to win that game, and would not have won against a competent coach. If they try that with Richt, Miles, or, yes, Saban on the opposite sideline, they will not be so fortunate.
On the other hand, luckily for Auburn they can try that and be quite successful against Ogeron on the last weekend in October.
At least if competence is the stand Mac’s throwing around.
yes mac, they were lucky, but over the past 3 years auburn has won similar games against all three of those coaches. it’s early. i look forward to seeing this team mature.
anywho, i can’t wait to see how LSU and UGA do in their first real test of the season and also see the result of the Bama-Vandy bout. Love me some SEC football.
LSU should have no problem with VA-Tech, if last Saturday’s game against Eastern Carolina is any indication. Terrible offense.
Discarded closer Bob Wickman’s troubles with the Braves began weeks before he was dumped, when he lashed out at RF Jeff Francoeur. Bobby Cox is the game’s most patient manager when it comes to players, but Wickman learned what happens when Cox has had enough…
http://sports.yahoo.com/mlb/news;_ylt=AschXlz1wo_H9.5BUY_BuQsRvLYF?slug=insidedishcoxdropswickma&prov=tsn&type=lgns
What I meant was that the KSU coach (1) failed to make any adjustments to the fact that Quentin Groves was manhandling his tackle, and (2) stupidly tried for a blocked punt with a fourth quarter lead. I don’t see many SEC coaches (other than the Mississippi Incompetence Brigade, and maybe Nutt on a bad day) doing that.
yeah, but i always wonder if teams keep it vanilla in games before they play a big opponent.
yeah, but i always wonder if teams keep it vanilla in games before they play a big opponent.
Bingo. Beamer wasn’t giving anything away. I don’t think LSU can take anything away from that game.
SC did the same thing in a very pedestrian win over Idaho. Carroll wasn’t giving Nebraska any hints.
actually groves switched sides on the series because the backs kept chipping him. i don’t really fault their coach for trying to put it away, they were on the road playing in front of the biggest crowd ksu has ever played in front of. his players got tired and started making mistakes and auburn was able to take advantage of those mistakes.
beedee,
I was referring to the cartoon, which didn’t seem to reference what that game was about.
If anyone over there had a sense of humor (self-deprecating or not), it would’ve shown someone in an Auburn hat & facepaint praying with the dwindling scorboard clock in the background.
Then fill in the punchline. Perhaps the next panel would show the K-State coach getting zapped by some divine power. His brain melting down. His head popping off. His team imbued with the spirit of Roy Riegels. Something.
You won. Be happy. I’d be happy. But I’d also be thankful. I damn-sure wouldn’t stick my chest out.
dude i’m thrilled we survived…minus the face paint that was me praying!
how do you pronounce Lohse?
I pronounce it “Lousy” but that’s probably incorrect.
good to know mac
It’s kind of funny to hear Pete giving the score of the Mets game, kind of like it matters. And then Chip gives the “if the Dodgers, Rockies, Diamondbacks all lose tonight and the Braves beat the Phillies . . .” I guess they get paid to make it seem like we have a snowball’s chance.
Where has Skip Caray been? Did they sit him out for making disparaging comments about Fox on Saturday?
wow, buddy is really lighting them up tonight! let’s put this thing on ice.
this game is over
recap, mac?
3-0=game over.
No heart.
What just happened…
did we enter a wormhole or is Jo Jo hitting right now?
…rookie.
In my first post I state that starting pitching is the Braves’ weakness. I don’t see it being solved by trading Renteria for Garland, even if the White Sox were willing to make that deal. We won’t get a solid number 2 or 3 unless we trade one of our studs. You don’t get value for nothing.
I guess it was too much to expect a 2 game winning streak from this team.
What stud?
This team looks liike a bunch of zombies when they fall even just one run down.
Well, Hooters will probably nominate Chipper.
Dan – Thorman?
hahahahahaha…sorry.
But see, the Braves aren’t trading Chipper Jones. And I doubt too many teams see a slow third baseman with constant foot problems as a stud.
To acquire a #2 or #3, you need to find a team in search of a shortstop and hope Renteria/Escobar plus prospects works out. The White Sox fit the bill, but the rumors are their #1 offseason target is David Eckstein.
A friend of mine told me today that Torii Hunter turned down an offer from the Twins yesterday.
Any truth to this and could he be a replacement for Andruw or are the Braves promoting in house?
This says Torii Hunter turned down a 3YRS/45M offer from the Twins:
http://www.mlbtraderumors.com/2007/09/torii-hunter-tu.html
I can’t see the Braves spending $15 mil/per for a centerfielder when they desperately need pitching. I think they’d resign Andruw first, anyway.
I don’t know. Stranger things have happened.
willie harris sucks.
kind of expected him to start doing pushups out infront of home plate there.
wow… 2 straight pop-ups
The Braves must be setting a record for the most infield popups in a season by one team.
this blue calling everything isn’t helping.
Walking is the new hitting.
Well…they got one.
Vintage Braves from 2007.
By the way, where is the hitting coach these days. Willie Harris has a massive upper cut with all his swings lately.
They’re ready to go golfing.
More funny use of the pen. Mahay used against a bunch of righties instead of holding him for the next time Utley and Howard are due up. Then we get another Acosta appearance instead of Ascanio or Villareal (he seems to have disappeared–he hasn’t pitched since last Tuesday).
Not that it matters given the offensive offense.
Lousy call on the Esccobar 3rd strike–no way he went around. Cox will get a chance to pad his record.
One more replay–change lousy call to borderline call.
The march toward mediocrity continues.
Well, bright side is, after going 1 and 1 they can still go 19 and 6. Err..
Seriously, we may have FINALLY seen the end of Willie Harris after another 0 for 5. I think its time that the Braves go for a legitimate lead-off hitter (KJ strikes out too much for my liking).
The march has arrived at mediocrity.
Re the earlier discussion of moves to make for next season: While starting pitching is the top priority, I think getting another OF (assuming AJ isn’t resigned) is also necessary. An outfield of Harris, Frenchy, and Diaz just isn’t enough. Brandon Jones had a good season this year and should be given a chance to compete, but he shouldn’t be counted on yet.
Boy, that one pretty much summed up the year huh?
Willie has lost the toe tap that made him a good hitter. TP should have noticed this many games ago. I’m actually looking forward to the retooling of management in 2009. It’ll be like culling an ill-tempered hen that is no longer laying eggs. “No production? You are stew.”
Can anyone tell me why why why Bobby Cox will not let Matt Diaz start for the rest of the year ??? It is just amazing.
He is getting older and not making good decisions anymore. It will happen to all of us if we live long enough. And may we all.
Go Braves.
Maybe Bobby should just be the bench coach after 2008. He’s taken a step down in responsibility before and he would still be incredibly valuable in that role.
Just a random thought…
And yes, I know that will never happen.
I’m afraid the season is now officially over. Not because we lost tonight, but because the puppy and kitten pictures don’t seem to be working. If they don’t work, nothing will.
Seriously, I know there’s been a lot of discussion about possible CFs for next year. I say we put all that we have into another starting pitcher. James can be a solid #4 and Cormier is looking like he can handle #5 with Reyes or even Lerew in the wings. The Braves built their team around 3 or 4 great pitchers and that’s the only way we’ll build it back. I think Brandon Jones is ready to make a strong contribution next year and we don’t need to make any trades for bullpen help with the young guys (Acosta, Ring, Ascanio, Devine, Stockman, …) and Moylan, Mahay and Soriano.
One trade or free agent signing of an impact starter is all JS needs to build a championship caliber team for he and Bobby’s swan song. Of course, the team will have to overcome some poor managing unless changes are made. Losing Woodward will also be a big upgrade to our bench.
Didn’t see one pitch of the game tonight, so I have no idea how good or bad the umps were—but Chipper gives me an idea…
http://www.ajc.com/sports/content/sports/braves/stories/2007/09/04/chipper_0905.html
I caught most of the later pitches. Escobar broke his wrists, IMHO. The HP ump was calling a high strike, but many of the pitches were easily front of the belt high. If we’d stop swinging at the tee we might get a few more hits.
I swear I read the exact same article about Chipper whining about the umps two months ago. The umps aren’t the problem.
If we’re gonna get lousy calls, we might as well get them now. Ain’t keeping me up at night.
url,
I saw a really good rock flick this weekend that you might like: “Festival Express.” It’s a documentary shot in 1970 about a trans-Canada train tour with the Dead, The Band, Janis Joplin, Flying Burrito Brothers, etc.
It’s on IFC a lot now. The live stuff from The Band, especially, is really great & it really captures a wild time in America.
* make that North America.
http://www.790theticket.com/showaudioarchive.php?show=The%20Dan%20Le%20Batard%20Show%20with%20Stugotz#
While I realize advertising is bad, I insist people eat at Baumhower’s wings place in Tuscaloosa. Also, I have newfound respect for Dan Le Batard after hearing his scheming prank. (second link)
Wow, hadn’t heard about that film, ububba. That tour has always been the stuff of legend. I’ll add it to the Netflix queue. Thanks!
“I got more walks than strike outs in my career. I know what a strike is …”
I love Chipper Jones.
url,
What’s hysterical about the film is how all the fans just expected the concerts to be free. Parting with $14 in the post-Woodstock Era just wasn’t happening, so the promoters took a bath.
Very funny the art/commerce and music-as-political statement thing that was going on.
But, the crazy stuff was the all-night jams on the train. And there’s a scene with Rick Danko, Janis Joplin & Jerry Garcia that you just gotta see. They are beyondo pickled, playing & singing “Ain’t No More Cane.”
It’s actually better than “The Last Waltz” scene of Neil Young with a white cadillac hanging out of his nose, and that’s hard to do.
Hey, Chipper, shut up and swing. Seriously what is with this team crying about umpiring? This isn’t the NBA. You can’t work the refs in baseball. Stop blaming the men in blue for your teamwide hitting slump.
I don’t see Glavine back, as much as I still like him, Mets are going to pay him for 08 if he wants to play next year. But, I’ve not heard much discussion about another former ace who is supposedly up for free agency. Could we afford Maddux? While he wouldn’t be an ace, he could be a solid #3 for us, AND who wouldn’t like to see him retire as a Brave?
Maddux wants to pitch for west coast teams close to his Las Vegas home. I doubt he’d come back to the Braves. I’d love to have either him or Tommy next year though. Both of them even at their age are more effective than any of our starters not named Smoltz and Hudson.
IMO, Chipper and the umps were even on the night. Chipper got a crummy call in his last AB–the pitch looked both low and away. On an earlier AB–the walk that forced in a run–ball four looked like it was down the middle and belt to bellybutton high.
As for Willie Harris, I hate to say I told you so, but several weeks ago when Willie’s average was still in the mid 300s, I predicted he would end up hitting about .280. People said no way b/c that would mean he would hit something like .200 the rest of the season. After this game, he is hitting .285.
I really find this team uninteresting and disheartening. The vaunted offense can never come back. They either beat the hell out of teams or they lose. Maybe with better pitching the offense would be more consistent but these guys need to improve their situational hitting a lot–it’s been abysmal most of the year, except for the blowouts when they score 14 runs. I’m tired of seeing guys pop up with the bases loaded. I’m sure they are trying to hard but they need to stop worrying and just start playing. Oh well, it’s over for this year anyway–except in Chip Carey’s idiot delusions. The one good thing about no TBS games next year is no Chip Carey.
Chipper is probably right about the umpiring but so what? It’s bad for both teams.
As a known pessimist, I hesitate to write this, but I’m not all that sure that next year will be much better. The Braves might be in a down cycle until they get some pitching. The only positive is that hopefully as these hitters get more experience they will improve their situational hitting. That and, hopefully, a higher payroll.