Cincinnati 8, Atlanta 3 – MLB – Box Score – Reds at Braves

Who is worse, Adam LaRoche or Dan Kolb? That’s a tough one, huh?

Marcus was the offense today. He hit a solo homer in the first and another one in the sixth. Down 3-2 in the eighth, he hit a two-out triple that just missed being his third homer, then scored on Chipper’s double.

Horacio Ramirez pitched okay, going 7 2/3 and allowing three runs on a solo homer in the first and a two-run homer in the seventh. He left with the bases loaded, but McBride got the strikeout to keep the game at 3-2.

Adam LaRoche is killing the Braves. Nobody else has a first baseman hitting .247/.311/.424. Few have #5 hitters who strike out on three pitches with one out, runners first and third in the eleventh. If Bobby isn’t going to give more of his ABs to Julio, he at least has to get LaRoche out of the five spot. I’d use McCann and Estrada there, but anything would have to be better than LaRoche is right now.

Well, not Dan Kolb. To be fair, if not for the stupid overshift on Griffey he would have gotten a double play to get out of the twelfth. In the end, though, he allowed five runs on four hits and a walk, capped by a grand slam to reach the final score — and take away a chance to maybe re-tie the game. Anthony Lerew made his major league debut by retiring the Reds’ last two batters, though why not just let Kolb keep pitching at that stage?

The good news is that the Marlins and Phillies lost. The Braves maintain a five game lead… The Braves host the Mets for three, starting with Thomson going against… oh, no, not him… Steve Trachsel. Everybody drink a couple of pots of coffee if they want to make it through that game. It will be on TBS, but Smoltz-Pedro in the second game will be on — you guessed it! — Turner South. It’s uncanny.

34 thoughts on “Cincinnati 8, Atlanta 3”

  1. In response to the last request, I haved agreed not to curse but Mac and I will both shut this website down if we can’t make personal attacks on the following people:

    LaRoche, Cox, Kolbb, Brower, Reitsma and anyone else who at some point is KILLING the Braves.

    And I blame Cox far more for today’s loss then Kolbb or LaRoche because it was COX who decided to AGAIN bat LaRoche fifth. Mac and I are both steadfast that laRoche has to move off the 5th spot, out of the order entirely off the team.

    Side note: Hollandsowrth is a joke too. God he stinks.

    So to answer the question…no more cursing but I have free reign to be abnle to vent all I want against guys like LaRoche who are KILLING the Braves.

  2. I definitely bought into LaRoche last year when he hit so well in the 2nd half, but he may have finally converted me to a non-believer.

    First of all, I was disgusted when Marcus stole 2nd. I knew he just took the bat out of Andruw’s hands, and clearly, Andruw is more dangerous with a runner on first than LaRoche is with a runner on 2nd.

    When LaRoche came up in the 11th, I did not even consider the possibility that he would be able to get a runner in from 3rd with less than two outs. I was just hoping that he did not hit into a DP so Francoeur would get a chance. When you know it’s going to be a double play or a strikeout, he should definitely not be batting fifth. And he is likely squandering any possible future with the Braves.

  3. I still don’t think Reitsma should be given such a hard time, but it’s hard to argue with any of those other guys–they’ve all been killing us.

    And I think personal attacks on Bobby might be a bit much, considering the bigger picture. I’ll question his decisions as fast as anyone, but I won’t be making comments like, “Bobby stinks.”

  4. When we failed to score in the 11th after loading the bases, I knew we were going to lose. And why not give up a grand salami while you’re at it, too? God, is Dan Kolb awful. We still had a chance until he served up that beach ball. If he is on the postseason roster I will not watch when he pitches. Albert Pujols and Jim Edmonds will eat him for lunch.

    This has already been said, but Adam LaRoche sucks. I question Marcus stealing second base with Andruw at the plate and thus causing an intentional walk (well, there was a wild pitch!), but seeing as how he WAS the entire offense today and we had much worse problems, like Kolb and LaRoche striking out on 3 pitches with runners at first and third, I will let that go. LaRoche is flat out awful. If he really is just in a slump, he should not be batting 5th. Bat Francoeur 5th and LaRoche 7th or 8th. If this is how he is, we should play him less often and look for somebody else (Chipper?) in the offseason, because he is doing nothing. I wanted to throw my soda at the TV when he struck out. That is totally inexcusable. Worst at-bat ever.

    On another note, to all those out there in the sports world that said Marcus Giles sucked defensively: would you like some A-1 sauce with your crow?

  5. So we all know Bobby loves the lefty in the 5 spot. Presumably to protect his cleanup hitter from late-inning ROOGYs?! OK, I guess I don’t know exactly why. But it’s true: righty 4 = lefty 5. So, yeah, as much the second part of it pains me, I’d have to agree that the McCann/Estrada tandem should be there. At least when there’s a right-handed starter.

  6. Why Kolb in the 12th? He uses Farnsworth in the 9th. Reitsma in the 10th, Foster in the 11th…then Kolb? Why put that crap out there then. It’s not like he was out of better options. He should have conceded the game in the 9th and pitched Brower (or Kolb) if he didn’t plan on going for the win. Davies is rested, Boyer had to have an inning in him.

    The good news is that Kolb HAS to have finally pitched his way off any potential postseason roster. Especcially with the way LaRoche is playing, we don’t even need a mop-up pitcher.

  7. The only potentially acceptible reason is that this was THE make-or-break appearance. That has to be it. This game will not have died in vain!

  8. has TP not worked with LaRoche to shorten his swing? At least with 2 strikes. The guy looks like he is uppercu-helicopter swinging at everything. Putting the bat on the ball, taking a few to left field would do wonders.

  9. What does Marte have to do to get some playing time? Down by five runs and Bobby gives the bat to Betemit? I’m not even going to mention the Brian Jordan PH.

  10. I susre wish Belliard and Lockhart would mail Marte a copy of the pictures. Its clear to me that LaRoche has a copy. The only good thing from this loss is that Kolb may be pitching his way off the post season roster (should we get there and not counting my chickens etc.)

  11. Kolb is Kolb. The thing I like Kolb is like he keeps proving Bobby that he sucks. I admire the guy’s consistency. If Bobby will continue to give Kolb chances to prove his suckness, there is nothing Kolb can do except continue to suck.

    Same thing applies to LaRoche…maybe he deserves a little more time than Kolb considering his promising first half this year and second half of last year, but…boy, does he look awful at the plate recently. What I suggest is send him back to the minor to see if he can be the lefthanded version of Jorge Sosa… .247 is a pretty good batting percentage for a pitcher…he is no Mark Grace or John Olerud, not even close. I still hope Adam will eventually prove me wrong, but seems to me that the Braves are lucky to have two halves of productive season from LaRoche.

  12. I’ve concluded that Bobby is finalizing the post season roster in his mind, and that winning the game is almost secondary at this point. Marte not getting a PH appearance means that he is not being seriously considered for the post season roster, while BJ and T. Folly are battling it out for the last position-player spot (so they got opportunities). Betemit is going to be on the post season roster, so he has to get some pinch hit appearances. For pitchers, I think 8 of 11 roster spots are firm, and that (in no particular order) Thompson, Hampton, Brower, Davies, Kolb, McBride, and maybe Lerew have a shot at the last 3 spots. So, we will be seeing all them as he finalizes his choices. Once you stop seeing a pitcher (or frequency drops way down), you will know that they have been eliminated. I’m not saying I agree with all this, but I think that’s what going on.

  13. To be fair, if not for the stupid overshift on Griffey he would have gotten a double play to get out of the twelfth.

    I can’t even put into words how much I hate that f*#$%ing shift. That play has got to go, and the guy who invented it should be banned from baseball for life (ok, I guess that was Lou Boudreau, so he should be banned in death, too). It cost us a game down in Florida when Delgado hit a grounder to shortstop who unfortunately couldn’t make the play because he was subbing for the second baseman, and it may have cost us today’s game as well.

  14. You’re absolutely right, Steffen. I thought of the Delgado-Reitsma game as the Griffey bouncer was headed into the outfield, too. Especially with runners on base, the shift just seems to not be worth the risk.

  15. I hate the shift. It’s dumb and the only reason it works at all is as a challenge to the batter’s manhood that might make him try to pull the ball. I swear, Griffey could bunt for a double against it.

  16. Barry Zito just drove a stake through the heart of my fantasy team (with a decent start tonight, I advance in the playoffs and come that much closer to winning 650 bucks… oh well). I’m glad I missed watching this game for a chance to see the Phils lose in person – beautiful day at RFK, by the way. Love the sausages with grilled onions and peppers there… mmmmmm, tasty.

    Anybody got big plans for labor day? My wife and I are playing p0ker and grilling out with some friends at our place.

  17. Another stupid thing about the shift is that Furcal and Giles are being positioned so close that they will run into each other on ground balls between them. With Furcal’s range and Giles’ agressiveness, they almost ran into each other the other night.

  18. Cox has the 3rd highest career winning percentage among managers with more than 2000 career wins. His team is on the verge of winning a 14th consecutive division title. He is unquestionably one of the all-time greatest baseball managers.

    Cox gets second guessed constantly on this web site (and others). Complaining is clearly a fan’s perogative, but (IMO) many of those criticisms show a lack of foresight and perspective – especially on the part of those who inexplicably insist on assigning personal blame for every single loss.

    Cox consistently wins, his teams consistently exceed pre-season expectations, his players are loyal, and his teams tend to be populated with likeable, well behaved players. What more can a fan reasonably ask? Most fans of other teams would dearly love to have a “problem” like having Bobby Cox managing their team.

    Cox certainly does deserve the occasional criticism for game day decisions, but I do NOT think that he deserves “personal” attacks from any Braves fan. I can’t even fathom how any true fan of the team could think otherwise.

    I also don’t see any particular justification for personal attacks on players like Reitsma, or even LaRoche. AFAICT, both of the players are nice guys who are trying hard. They have also been valuable members of the team at times, even if their recent performances have been disappointing. What exactly did these players do that justifies personal attacks?

    I think that the future of the Braves at first base should probably be Chipper or Marte, but I don’t see how that makes LaRoche somehow deserving of personal attacks.

  19. Big Labor Day plans?

    Yes, gonna catch the Braves-Mets matinee & then at night it’s off to Ibiza, Spain for a week of general craziness. Gonna hit the internet cafes (2 Euros per 1/2 hour) & check on this forum to get the real deal on the Bravos.

    On Tuesday, I’m quite sure that, like a fool, I’m gonna be in some big nightclub wondering about the Smoltz-Pedro matchup.

    Ever try to keep up with MLB in Europe? Damn-near impossible, unless you luck up & your hotel gets ESPN. It’s all soccer & sports you only see in the Olympics.

    Mac, your game stories are on-point. Thanks for being so consistent. Gonna need ’em this week.

  20. Joel,

    For the most part, regarding Cox, I’m with you.

    As a lifelong Braves fan who all too well remembers the particularly hopeless eras of Rowland Office, Ozzie Virgil, etc., I relish every moment of this run.

    I watch the Braves for enjoyment, not as a means to vent. I get disappointed, sure, and I definitely have my moments with Cox, esp. with the relievers these days; but overall this is a fun team & a great organization to follow.

  21. I’m with you Joel. I suppose this is just the way normal fans are, but everyone must admit we are truly blessed to have a manager like Cox. I would bet any team in the NL East would love to have him.

    I think the personal attacks are pretty whack too, but that’s just human nature to be irrational, short-sighted, and impatient. One guy loses a game for us: he’s gone! If they managed like that, no one would want to play for us. Just think if we dealt Furcal; everyone would be hating Schuerholz even though many people were suggesting that earlier in the season.

  22. Cox has the 3rd highest career winning percentage among managers with more than 2000 career wins. His team is on the verge of winning a 14th consecutive division title. He is unquestionably one of the all-time greatest baseball managers.

    I don’t think “unquestionably” is accurate. These things are always up for debate.

    Cox’s record without Mazzone? 621-615 (.502)

    The three of them (Leo & Cox & JS) have been working together so long, it’s hard to separate any one of them has being more influential than the others. If anything, the success of the Braves pitching staff points to Mazzone as being the most valuable member. However, it can be argued that Cox is the most important, but it’s far from “unquestionable”.

  23. Joel and Rob, what’s your definition of “personal attack”? I hardly find anything on this site which criticize a player beyond his pure performance on the field. Yes, I believe LaRoche must be a nice person, but he sucks right now and drags the whole offense down with him. Whatís wrong with complains like that?!

  24. The overall level of nasty, uninformed second-guessing, whining, and know-it-all bullshit on this site is so high as to render it all but unreadable. I mean, it’s just laughable.

  25. The overall level of nasty, uninformed second-guessing, whining, and know-it-all bullshit on this site is so high as to render it all but unreadable. I mean, it’s just laughable.

    At least you were able to take the high road.

  26. Crunch time. Time to keep track of the magic number (21)to clinch. Perhaps, Kolb has now convinced Cox that no lead is safe when Kolb is pitching. Regardless of the switch he was horrible in 1/3 of an inning. I may be wrong but I think the only way Lerew can make the postseason roster is if someone on the postseason roster goes on the dl.

  27. Evaluating managers is tough. Bill James wrote (yet another) very good book on the subject. I read it some time ago, but I remember the bottom line as being that the ones who hang around must be doing something right, else they would (eventually–Chuck Tanner!) be replaced. He had some “objective” points system for them, and five years ago Cox was almost the best. By now he probably is the best. We’ll be the worse for it when he decides to move on….

    This said, count me among those (like Parish) who found themselves hoping that LaRoche would strike out in the 11th, lest he hit into a double play instead. And I’m still trying to figure out how he failed to score from second with two outs in the eighth last week.
    I do like his fielding.

  28. I don’t think that was Kolb out there yesterday afternoon – it was James Gandolfini. With all apologies to James Gandolfini – he could probably get more MLB hitters out right now.

  29. Dan Kolb Sucks!!!!!! The Braves have a better chance with the peanut vender pitching than him. Get rid of him he’s horrible! If he pitches in the post season we’ll loose 4 sure.

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