[Rocky II is a slugfest. And after lots of slugging, Rocky comes out on top. So, that is kind of like this one.]
Ender Inciarte (who is demonstrating himself to be a good major leaguer) tripled to start the game. That is a good start. Adonis hit a ground ball, so it was Atlanta 1, Miami 0 after 1.
Through the first 3 innings, Braves fans got to enjoy “Good Mike Foltynewicz.” 5 strikeouts. No walks. No runs. By the 4th Braves had put up a single run on a Nick Markakis homer in the 2nd. Then, put up 5 runs by singles and a sacrifice fly (think “jabs”). So, with a 7 to 0 score, Folty turns into “Bad Folty.” Hits the first batter and gets hit by most of the others including a hit to his body after which he was pulled. Ryan Weber came on in relief with two outs and the bases loaded. He got Justin Bour to put the ball in the air in center field which obviously meant an out.
As our slugging match continued, The Marlins tied it in the top of the 6th. In the bottom of 6, Neck doubled home Huggybear to get a lead of 8 to 7.
A pinch hitting Anthony Recker singled home Jace Peterson in the 7th to make it a 2 run lead.
Then, the knockout blows were landed in the bottom of 8. 3 more runs scored. Then, Jim Johnson pitched a perfect 9th.
A “Snitfully Joyous” night.
At least it wasn’t Rocky Horrors. Nice recap, Cliff. Thank you.
I left when we were up 7-0. I’m glad I missed the anxiety. Why their shenanigans should make me anxious this season, I do not know; but I still want those boys to win. Go figure.
When it comes to anxiety, however, my Dogs have it nailed.
Nothing wrong with wanting your team to win. All my buddies are watching MNF, and I’m agonizing over another Folty episode. It’s baked into the brain to cheer for the Tomahawk.
It’s almost weekly now that even the Braves media says that an outfield trade in the offseason is likely. Markakis now has a slightly above average OPS, mediocre range, and a strong arm. I really think you could not only move him, but you could get a legit prospect and not eat salary.
Your lips to God’s ears, Rob. We need to make room for Mallex.
If Braves win tonight, they’ll be 20-20 since the Kemp trade. Squint folks…I think there’s a competitive team in there with some key acquisitions and 20 pounds of weight loss.
That’s 19-20 with a pitching rotation comprised mostly of people who are possibly imaginary. If a few of these pitching prospects can at least be decent SPs one doesn’t have to squint all that hard.
On June 14th we were 18-46. Today, we are 56-88, which makes 38-42 over an 80 game stretch. We’re 19-20 since the Kemp trade, but we are scoring significantly more runs per game since the trade.
The main thing keeping us from being an above .500 team is starting pitching. The problem is that if we spend big on a couple of veteran starters, we block the pipeline of young pitchers who need auditions, which could include Weigel, Sims, and Povse next year. My hope is that if we sign a veteran pitcher, it’s a 1-year pillow deal. CJ Wilson is a prime candidate for that.
I wouldn’t mind signing a frontline starter to a big deal, but I’m wary of throwing a big deal at a mediocre mid-rotation veteran. I don’t want to repeat Derek Lowe’s contract.
On one or more starting pitchers to be acquired outside the organization.
One thing is what do you spend the money on. I could see doing extensions with some young uns (maybe Dansby) in exchange for options. But, that doesn’t spend money now. OCCASIONALLY they front load a little, but nobody does a lot of that.
So, we still potentially have $50 mill. Right now we know catcher is a need but also know a free agent contract for a catcher (particularly the ones available) is highly likely to blow up. We need a 3b, maybe. But a Garcia Ruiz platoon looks like a 2 to 3 WAR platoon and costs almost nothing. AND, then you have Riley out about 3 years (when Ruiz goes to arb) and then Maitan in 1 to 2 more. So, a long term deal at third is both expensive and likely not better than internal options unless it is a great player.
So, I would rather go in on one 2 to 3 pitcher AND one reclamation project. The 2 to 3 pitcher should be tradeable unless injured, so he doesn’t block anybody. Then, go maybe Jason Castro platooning with Flowers at catcher for 17 and 18. Then, if you have to give 3 to Castro, he backs up somebody else by then. If a 3B drops in your lap, get him. Then, if a corner OF drops in (Braun?), you make that move as well.
38 – 42 over half a season (80 games) is a pretty good sample. And, yes, if Folty steps up a hair more and Gant steps up a hair more and Newcombe or Sims could at least handle 5, then your short term need is somebody to slot either just before or just after Folty. Not sure who is out there.
Does anybody know if C.J. Wilson is actually going to pitch again?
It’s certainly possible that Wilson manages to make it back to the majors as a reliever.
But I would probably bet money that he never throws 100 innings in a season again, and it’s a good bet that he won’t throw 100 more major league innings before he retires.
Same for Mike Minor, another lefty with a hamburger shoulder who’s seven years younger than Wilson.
Julio’s still here too. Don’t know what the Pale Hose would need for Sale, and the guy’s got baggage; but somebody like him would take Teheran and Folty a slot lower in the rotation. That would strengthen our staff for sure.
I’d sacrifice Jace, Mallex, and a couple of Blairs to get somebody of his ilk. Nick the Greek, Ender and a more svelte Kemp could play the field unless that cheater Braun could be had at a fair price.
Edit: The postseason’s not even here yet, and it’s already fun.
Front-loading a contract is a strategy the Braves should look into.
11—Think it would take a good deal more than that to get Sale. Something like Newcomb, Soroka, and Acuna to even get the conversation started.
I think the Sox want more than that for Sale. They have him on a team-friendly deal for a few more years, and he’s one of the best 5 pitchers in baseball.
You’d probably need at least 3 of our prospects who are in the top-100. Something like Albies, Soroka, Fried, and Mallex could work. I feel no urgency to give up that kind of package, though.
P.S.: I was just looking at RoJo’s career to compare with Sale’s. Sale has 31.5 career WAR through his age 27 season so far. RoJo had 5.3 through that season. He had 99 WAR from age 28-45. Wow.
I don’t want to bankrupt the system for him, but I would ask. No Albies, Soroka, Fried, and Mallex though: my largesse extends only so far.
There was a lot of speculation that the Sox would move Sale before the deadline this year, because they were going nowhere and he’s one of the best pitchers in baseball. But they asked the moon (perhaps under orders from Jerry Reinsdorf, who sometimes is very unwilling to move his favorite guys).
He isn’t going anywhere. I doubt we have enough to get him, and even if we did, I doubt we’d be willing to pay it.
We would also be asking for the moon if we had a pitcher like Sale. Some of us (including me) were talking Moncada/Benintendi for Teheran who is half the pitcher.
Mallex, Albies, Soroka, and Anderson for Sale would be a trade I would do if I were the Braves, but I doubt it would get it done, and I wouldn’t go any higher. So, it’s not going to happen. The problem is that Teheran is still only 25. He’s still developing, and he could turn into an ace within the next couple years. Same thing with Folty, though much less likely. I would be inclined to trade a lot of the high minors glut of AAAA/4th-5th starter fodder for a position player, and hope for the best with the rotation. Trade three of Jenkins, Blair, Ellis, Whalen, and Perez, and I don’t think we miss a beat. Teheran, Folty, Wisler, one or two Bud Norris-type FA SPs, whoever’s left from the Wonder Quintuplets, and then hope Newcomb, Sims, and/or Weigel could do something to impact the major league roster in 2017. Trade Markakis, trade Adonis, and front load some money, and you’ve got a really good squadron. And remember, you’re going to have a dirt cheap bullpen with some of the high minors guys getting a shot in there too.
Who is RoJo? Rondy Johnson?
Wait a minute… Randy’s name isn’t Rondy! You’re a fraud!
He used to go by “Red” in winter league ball.
The Sox won’t move Sale for less than a Texiera type deal. The only teams that should be in on Sale are ones that are a front line starter away (Houston, Boston, Washington…)
The Braves should focus on bringing in innings eaters who can be our #3-4 guys. If these young guys show they are ready, then we can trade the vets.
I am only comfortable with Julio and Folty at this point.
Considering I don’t expect them to get to playoffs next year, I’m comfortable with everyone.
@19, it’s Rondy who’s the fraud, going around asking people to call him Randy
@18, “Trade three of Jenkins, Blair, Ellis, Whalen, and Perez, and I don’t think we miss a beat.”
Heavens to murgatroyd, why would we miss a beat without that motley crew? Trade all five if you can find a taker.
@23
I think you ought to keep one of them as a 5th starter candidate, and another as a long reliever. I would keep Blair because he experienced such a value dip this year that you probably want to recoup some of that value, and Perez might have more value to us than another team. But I would definitely trade Jenkins, Ellis, and Whalen. They have 5th starter written all over them, and we just have too many people vying for the pleasure of being a 5th starter for our team that we just simply can’t keep them all.
The biggest thing is that the roster badly needs to be reshuffled. There is just way too much of the same type of player. 3 OFs for 2 spots all with similar profiles. 2 3Bs that would probably produce the same amount of value. 2 second basemen. 7 4th-5th starters. 5-6 middle relievers. Bunch that stuff up and get a real player or two. Frankly, this is how Coppy will earn a good reputation, not calling for highest and best when you scrap off your team.
The biggest problem is a lack of overall talent. We have too many below average players and not enough above average players. I doubt we can trade several below average players for one above average player. There’s a reason we could so readily acquire those type of players: nobody really wants them.
So Flowers hit Dansby right in the Swanson?
Right in Swanson’s Johnson.
@25
I think there’s a chance that we could have above average talent at nearly every single position on the field next year if Braves can trade Markakis and if they’ll go grab a 3B that can produce 2-3 WAR. FF5, Albies, Swanson, 3B, Mallex, Kemp, and Ender could all be 2+ WAR players IMO. Kemp, obviously, will have to lose weight. Collecting 20-25 WAR among that group would be spectacular, and not out of the question.
@25 I’d agree with you when it comes to the Braves’ position players – as it stands, there’s just not enough impact talent – though with Swanson / Ruiz / Albies / Smith / Peterson contributing next year there is hope that the Braves will at least have a pretty deep bench of average-to-good positional player talent in 2017.
On the pitching side, we’ve got a lot of arms with upper rotation ceilings (Newcomb, Fried, Allard, Weigel, Anderson, Soroka, Sims et al.) but only a few of those guys are likely to see much MLB time in 2017.
Looking at what the Braves have on hand, I have a hard time projecting the 2017 Braves as more than an average-ish team, but it seems likely to me that Coppy is going to do some real wheeling-dealing this offseason, probably both buying and selling.
You don’t see a Snagglepuss quote everyday.
http://www.nbcsports.com/player-news?sport=MLB#player-news-item_2
I didn’t figure out why Braves thought they needed Lalli up to have 3 catchers so bad. But, I guess they knew that Recker had one on the way. So, we might see Lalli between now and Friday.
@31
I thought it was interesting that they burned their 3rd catcher last night. Flowers caught all night, and Recker and Lalli pinch-hit. Bold.
@25
I really think you can turn some 24-year old prospects who were top-30 as recently as this year who have struggled at the big league level into something decent. If they were so readily available, then why have the injury-depleted Mets, a contender, had to hand 20 starts to guys that weren’t even on their top 30? Whalen, Jenkins, Gant, and Ellis have all appeared on our top 30 this year in a system that’s considered a top-3 system by most. If you don’t use prospect rankings, weighted within system rankings, as an indicator of value for prospects… then what valuation tool do you use? Do you use 7-8 starts at the big league level as a way of throwing out previous historical value? At the end of the day, while there may be too many of them to have value to us, cost-controlled 4th and 5th starters have value to others.
I’m watching the Marlins pre-game feed. They’re lauding Ichiro. Martin Prado dressed like a kamikaze pilot, and Barry Bonds looks to be the same size now as he was pre-‘roids.
@32, I thought you were talking about guys like Adonis, Flowers, and Markakis. Prospects are a different story. I still think we’d have a hard time turning Whalen and Jenkins into an above average regular but, like I said, have at it. We have to move some of these guys. Once higher upside guys like Weigel, Newcomb, and Povse are pushing for starts, we’re not going to have any use for the Aaron Blairs of the world. We already have 3 rotation spots obligated to Teheran, Folty, and Wisler. Ellis and Gant need longer looks. Blair, Whalen, and Jenkins need to be traded
One thing I mentioned a while back that got jeered was to flip some of those guys for lower minors, higher ceiling guys. We just have too much mediocre pitching talent clogging the 40-man.
Austin Riley hit another homer today.
How good has he been? Including today, he’s hitting .284/.343/.543 with 18 HR since June. At age 19.
(Also including today, Freddie is hitting .322/.425/.638 since June. with 22 homers.)
Hart’s interview on the broadcast:
-Looking at Prado in FA
-Talking about young position players, “it’s not like the NFL or NBA. You can’t just snap your fingers and they’re there.” (Uhh, well, maybe you shouldn’t have gone on MLB Network and praised the Chris Johnson and Andrelton Simmons extensions and then traded them away when you realized you signed bad deals, don’t ya think?)
-Paco Rodriguez will be ready next year and “be a factor”. Spoke highly of AJ Minter: “nobody talks about him” and if we were in a pennant race, “he pitches for us.”
-Likes Jose Ramirez, actually. “Has a decision to make” about Jim Johnson. “Won’t jump too deep into bullpen free agent market”.
-Spoke highly of Snit.
-He wasn’t asked any questions about available monies, intensity in FA and trade markets in the offseason, etc.
Thanks, Rob.
Touki for Rome tonight: through 8 innings with 90 pitches / 65 strikes. 8ip, 1 run, 4 hits, 6k, NO WALKS. Very nice!
Touki!
Hart seemed to hedge on the management situation. Basically said Snit’s doing a good job and if you go out and hire somebody it has to be a guy who can work with so many young players. Sounded like he set them up to keep snit or hire “just the right guy” should he come along.
PS. Amazing season Freddie. He would get my vote for MVP. And it wasn’t that long ago you’d laugh if he were mentioned as the best first baseman in baseball, but this year, he has been that. Sit down Goldschmidt and Rizzo.
Matt Wisler doesn’t seem to be convincing anyone that he is an answer.
Recap is up.