What can I say, Ian Curtis was ahead of his time.
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What can I say, Ian Curtis was ahead of his time.
Use code “Journal” for a 5% discount.
JC’d: Good piece about Tony Gwynn: http://deadspin.com/i-was-tony-gwynns-bat-boy-1592123043
Batting order is out:
1. Heyward
2. B.J. Upton
3. Freeman
4. J. Upton
5. La Stella
6. Johnson
7. Simmons
8. Laird
9. Pitcher.
So much for a big shake up in the line up. B.J. is still 2-hole, so I consider the little changes mute in the fact that they probably were mostly influenced by Gattis being on the bench tonight.
Does this mean that Phil Collins is only good for a one game winning streak?
Also, I would have put La Stella at cleanup. Either he gets to hit with people on base in the first inning, or he leads off the second inning. Sounds win-win to me.
I think the book may be starting to come together on La Stella. He stands pretty far off the plate, especially for a shorter guy, and in his last three at-bats, the Phillies started attacking him on the outside edge with good results.
La Stella could lose 200 points of batting average and still be more productive than Dan Uggla. I’m not worried.
@5
They did attack the outside of the plate on him, but he did drill the ball with bases loaded. It just so happened to be on a rope to the 3rd baseman. The pop out and ground out in the last two plate appearances does not worry me because the guy is still making consistent contact. I don’t think the guy will hold at his current average, but even if he falls to .280, he is still a plus for us. Remember what Gonzalez said when calling him up about if he gives them a .260 average with good defense then he is doing what they want and expect. The torrid start might be fooling some into thinking he’s an all star which he may be in the future, but he is a solid player now which is all we can ask of him. On a fun note, La Stella can go 6 for his next 38 and still be hitting .300.
Was looking at Chris Johnson’s numbers today and discovered, as bad as he’s been, his BABIP is still .359. Made me curious as to what his numbers would be if his BB% and K% were at last years levels instead of this years.
Assuming all the K’s (that comprise the delta) were balls put in play, fell to hits at a 36% clip, and were all singles, his .276/.295/.352 line turns into a .291/.330/.368 one. Not great, but really only terrible in the context of power.
No real point, but it’s interesting how a 3% change in walk rate and 4% change in K rate can have on the perception of a player.
@8
I like how you worked that out. It does make one think of what could be. I know Johnson always has us worried when he is up with a man on 1st with less than two outs, but he has showed signs of last season’s hitting capabilities in the last few weeks.
Woohoo, Game time.
Down 2-0 and no Gattis…I’m going to start drinking.
Ryan Howard/Kyle Kendrick, a Braveskiller combo.
Ryan Howard…washed up against everyone but us. Maybe the draft pick we gave up for Ervin will turn into at HoF pitcher so we can gripe about that in a few years.
I’m starting a “Shut it, BJ” campaign. Who’s with me?
Following this team requires a sense of humor that I just don’t know if I have.
La Stella in clean up there gives us a better chance than having Upton at clean up did. Just saying.
@14 – I am with you Ryan. Looked like a strike to me. Plus my rules are you have to be hitting .250 (average) to bitch about balls and strikes. If he followed my rules, his days for belly aching would be over with.
@17
I agree. It is obvious he is the issue when it comes to knowing the strike zone and not the umpires. It is not like they have a conspiracy going to just call B.J. Upton out on strikes for the heck of it.
@18
According to him they do!
La Stella with another line out. I will take it all day. Still more fun to watch than a strike out or role over the top grounder.
La Stella has good at bats.
We are now at the abyss of our lineup. 7, 8, and 9 are just no fun for us. It is basically a lost inning tonight. I hope they prove me wrong.
Does anybody know how many pitches La Stella sees per at bat? I am sure it is a good average. He trusts his hands which seems to make him okay with taking some pitches.
Another reason we are not where we were last year. Our production with RISP with two outs average was off the charts last year. Tonight, already 0-2.
@24
Report from yesterday said 5, which is insane!
@ 25
He really should be moved up to lead off if he is seeing that many pitches per at bat.
@myself
A little research says report was wrong: 4.04 before today’s match.
A sense of humor that I just do not possess..
@27
I will still take 4.04 per at bat. That still has to be in the top 3 for the Braves if not be the top.
When will it stop?
Baseball is just a game. Whether the Braves win or lose doesn’t mean a lot in the great scheme of things, but …
I really dislike B.J. Upton.
@31
I really dislike B.J. Upton, too. I would love him if he were on another team in our division though. Also, we have to look at this. If we do not get Upton, we more than likely never get J. Upton or Johnson via trade. So we would have Prada at 3rd or LF. We would have another player at CF, LF, or 3rd depending on how we used Prada if we still had him. It is amazing how one move, aka B.J. Upton, changes the whole look of a team.
I’m not one to pile on, but…
BJ kinda gave them an extra run there. A good throw to 2B on the Brignac hit would’ve helped a lot. And it wasn’t that far a toss, just really inaccurate.
Also, it turned out not to matter, but he gave up an extra base on the subsequent hit as well. Even if you deke the runner on third into staying near 3B, you’re never going to throw him out on a one-hop single to CF (unless the runner’s Haystacks Calhoun). He pointlessly tried to throw Brignac out and needlessly gave up another base to the hitter. Lucky, there wasn’t further damage.
So… gotta go get ’em, Braves.
If this continues the Braves won’t be making a qualified offer to Santana. So we don’t have to worry about that draft pick.
@32 But we wouldn’t want to keep Prado at that price. At the end, I think it’s worth it…if BJ wouldn’t make himself so unlikable. We were so loving the idea of the Upton brothers….I think Justin has done his share….
@35 I love the J. Upton move, but I was never on board with the B.J. Upton move. I have never cared for him as a player all the way back to his Tampa days. So far, he had done nothing to prove me wrong in the past two seasons with the Braves. He is still hitting under .200 for his entire time with the Braves at this point.
Runs, please.
So were basically through 5ip. Santana has thrown 99 pitches, Kendrick 65. I wonder which team has the better approach.
Andrelton is in a 2-month slump where he has put up a .591 OPS. That’s Brendan Ryan bad.
@38 We are not through 5 innings yet. It is the bottom of the 5th.
That’s not a slump. That’s just a bad hitter.
That’s why I said basically through 5IP
Well done, Jason. Too bad BJ’s next.
Hoping this wouldn’t enter the equation of in-game tactics, but I wonder if Fredi would ever be reluctant to use Gattis to pinch-hit because of his hitting streak.
Chip away, chip away…
#44 – I really hope that wouldn’t matter.
I’ll admit, I was on board for the B.J. Upton signing. He’d essentially been a 3.5 WAR/yr player the 3 years prior, and even though his contract would take him into his age 32 season, his body type wasn’t necessarily the type for a drastic dropoff. Even if he were to average 2.5-3 WAR instead of 3-3.5, he would have been very close to being worth the contract. Just goes to show how freakishly unpredictable we humans are.
@44 Players just want to play. I remember years ago Mike Piazza was on a 30-game hit streak if I am not mistaking and told the manager to put him in to pinch hit. He lost his streak but gained a ton of respect. I have not seen anything in Gattis that would make me think he would do any differently. If Fredi is not willing to use him for the fact of a streak, he is a truly terrible manager. You play to win games.
BJ still killing us in the 2 hole
@csg
He might have an approach that drives us mad, but Andrelton is not this bad of a hitter. However, BJ most certainly is…
Hitting streak? No chance.
@50
I have said this in previous posts. Simmons is a above .300 hitter career at the 2-hole. He does so much better when pitchers are forced to give him better pitches due to having the 3 and 4 guys behind him. A pitcher can give him junk all day with the pitcher following him in the 8-hole. Also, he is one of the few players we have that can bunt when needed. I think it is a better option that B.J. there.
Kyle Kwndrick is the perfect pitcher to throw against the braves. Just junkball them to death and they’ll screw themselves into the ground swinging at it
@49 He is killing us regardless of where he hits….
I’m 70, and I’m almost as good an option batting second and playing second as BJ. Heck, I’d do it for less than $15 million, too.
I’ve always despised a poor hitting approach. It’s selfish and short-sighted and generally stubborn. It gets hard to root for some of these guys.
@56
B.J. Upton, J. Upton, C. Johnson all had these approaches long before coming to the Braves. The Braves new this and still went after them. Well, we got Johnson as a side note but we still got him. Simmons swings at everything, but at least, he doesn’t strike out much. Gattis is allowed to do what he does because he truly is the power model of old days, and I can handle him doing what he does. La Stella seems nice, but it is still too soon. Freeman and Heyward are really our only two people who will take deep counts that have adequate plate appearances to judge by. In the end, Frank Wren built this team this way and expected coaches to change players habits. The only players I can really put on Walker are the home grown Simmons and Gattis. Other than that, Freeman, Heyward, and La Stella work the count just like we want them, too. The other 3 players are products of other systems and are not willing to buy into any philosophy because they have all had the same approach under multiple hitting coaches.
Salty you jump into walker defense mode when I don’t even remotely mention him. What is your hard on for him?
Pinch hitting gattis for laird is a no brainer. Fredi is a mouth breathing Neanderthal
@58 I do not care for Walker. I just do not think he deserves the blame most give him. To be honest, I do not buy into the hitting coach setting the plate approach of a team. He is there to help when their are issues with a swing going on which he has tried to do with many of our players. I look at our lineup and most of the players career stats and know it is not coaching with the hitting. Like I said in my previous statement, the only two players we can truly say Walker may have failed so far is Simmons and Gattis as far as plate approach goes because they are his players in that they have only known him on a major league level. His other three home grown Atlanta players do fine. The other three who are from other backgrounds mentioned haven’t showed any willingness to change for any coaches they have had. Why should Walker take the blame for that. He can’t tell Fredi to bench them for not doing what they are told. Well, he can, but it will do no good because there are no other options.
I’m surprised Fredi didn’t let Doumit or Gattis hit for Laird there also.
Gattis isn’t going to catch 5 games in a row. He had knee surgery over the summer and they are really watching his workload.
But you jump to his defense when he’s not criticized. Granted its probably due to my prior criticism of him. Here’s the thing. Nobody has actually improved their approach under walker. Even Johnson who was 28 got worse, exponentially worse in terms of walk rate. I know for a fact what he teaches. And I know for a fact what he has taught heyward. It hasn’t helped. Simmons, highly impressionable, has gotten worse in terms of walk rate.
62-who said anything about him catching? We have 3 catchers
You guys who defend fredi’s decisions just blow my mind. Do you seriously believe he makes good decisions? Braves have tying run any the plate and they let two of their worst hitters bat consecutively??? That should be some combo of gattis doumit every time. Laird shafer???? You guys are sick
@47
ryan…’freakishly unpredictable’, yes…so we create a self-important behemoth that takes itself very seriously trying to do just that.
@52…agreed re Andrelton. He will become a .300 hitter when they place him where he belongs in a spot where he can define his responsibilities.
@60 The role of a hitting coach has evolved I believe. What you mentioned is the traditional role of a hitting coach and the role has been expanded. Just like how a pitcher has an approach to attack a lineup, an offense should have an overall approach on how to attack a pitcher on a given night.
In my opinion, there is only two ways we can approach the hitting issue. I agree with you that each player has their own tendency, but it’s either 1) our advanced scouting quality has deteriorated; or 2) there is something wrong with Walker and Fletcher’s overall approach in the role of a hitting coach.
And I am not sure how we can be happy with Heyward’s and Simmon’s hitting development in the past couple years unless we think they are performing at their talent level already.
@65 I agree with you in that fact. I think our major issue is Fredi over whoever we put at hitting coach. In the past few weeks, he has made some decisions that make no sense at all. Even Chip and Joe have been taken aback on a few occasions. There is our true issue. He makes the line up card. He is the one that could probably change things up by moving people around and looking at career numbers from different spots in the lineup because spot in the line up affects people approach way more than what they are told to do. The reason Johnson’s walk total may be down this year is where he has been batting. He hit way better in the 7 and 8 whole last year with more walks and more power. Could there be something there?
Once you guys accept that we’re not a good team you’ll be able to enjoy your summer a lot more.
68-it may not be the main issue, but there’s no reason Johnson should have ever hit cleanup. That is pure insanity.
69-I do admit you fredi supporters have a certain religious level happiness. You believe in his fatness no matter what he does and when someone points out the obvious you say they’re “not a true fan”.
@69
philosophically perfect…
@71 Is there really a religious level happiness with Fredi around here? I honestly don’t think so. I actually think the consensus here is that he is definitely not one of the best managers in the game but definitely not the worst either.
We have had enough Fredi bashing that we are now shifting to a new target. At the end of the day, the win total of the team has improved. If we don’t win the division this year, the full Fredi bashing will return I am sure.
@69 I am indeed slowly accepting what you said.
@70 Johnson value has always been a bottom of the order bat. His career splits even say this. Heck this year even says that in the fact that before the game he was hitting at a .429 clip in 28 PAs. Our entire lineup is an issue of people hitting out of place. Heyward’s best career numbers have come from the 6-hole. I think Heyward does better from spots in the order where less is expected of him. Anyways, I could go on all night about where players might be better hitting. I mean B.J.’s best spot to hit is from the bench. It would save him the walk to and from home plate.
On a side note from the serious, does anybody else think Laird and Gonzalez look just alike? I swear sometimes I mix them up when it is just a passing glance.
@75 Your new to Braves Journal eh?
@76 I am. I have to say that I really like it so far. I used to be a regular on the ESPN Braves’ forums until they took them down. I just finished grad school and was looking for a new place to talk Braves and came across this one. It has been great thus far.
73-among fredi apostles, yes. That includes Dave obrien
@77 – Long story for a new poster: Some people around here refer to Laird as AFG, for “Another Fredi Gonzalez” which is a play on our host, Alex Remington, whose handle is “Another Alex R” because when he first started posting here, there was already an Alex R. So “Another Alex R” is often shortened to “AAR,” thus Laird is “AFG.”
@77 Welcome! Yes, we refer to those two as The Original Fredi Gonzalez (Fredi) and Another Fredi Gonzalez (Laird) since they do look just alike. It’s pretty eerie.
Welcome. This is the premier baseball blog. Take a look at rhe glossary.
BTW the batting order doesn’t have anything to do with a players performance.
Avilan continuing his fine work this season
And on an unrelated note, I think they should sell all the players, change the name of the team, move it to some other city, burn the stadium to the ground, and salt the earth on which it stood. And then we can all pretend this team never happened. What a s%*t show.
Holy shit. Now Simmons can’t even field.
@83 – seconded.
@81 Thanks for the welcome, but I do disagree with the batting order not having anything to do with a players performance. Some player thrive on pressure and others do not. There are certain positions in the order that add pressure to perform. Freeman thrives on pressure situations. Heyward does not for example. Thus, Heyward has better numbers from lower in the lineup such as 6-hole. Look at his career splits from that spot in the lineup. It is true for many other players in or lineup. Simmons being another one who thrives from the 2-hole for example.
Well let’s put 3 or 4 up on Papelbon. He’s a bigger douche than Teixeira.
As miserable as this game and the Braves are right now, it has actually been interesting to listen to Smoltz tonight. He’s pretty articulate.
@83 I think the Braves are trying to do the next best thing by moving to Cobb County!!! We can’t say they don’t know what they are doing.
salty, you can’t find a better braves blog than here. Common sense and civilized opinion are hard to find nowadays. We may not agree with each other on everything but that’s perfectly normal regardless of what we do.
@87 I wish they could just replace Chip Carey with Smoltz/Glavine/Chipper. As Don Sutton has proved, HoFers know their trade very well.
It hasn’t been discussed much that Simmons’ defense has regressed some.
@88 Since the Braves have only won a single World Series in each city they’ve played in, I am certainly banking on the franchise believing that Cobb County is a new city. The bad thing is that we have to be there for 30 years, so we all need to really enjoy the one title we win there.
To me, this team is like, a team full of driving-range heroes. It’s 25 guys who have excellent ability to perform the individual actions required to play the game of baseball, but who just have no idea what to do with themselves in actual baseball games. They are a bunch of bed-wetters who have no idea how to approach at-bats, no idea what the opposing pitcher might be trying to do to them, and don’t even know what base to throw the ball to on defense. Sometimes they don’t even seem to have a firm grasp on the rules that govern the game.
What an insufferable sorry bunch of losers.
@69 – That’s pretty close to how I came to terms with golf.
At least tonight’s game isn’t 13-inning long.
Hey y’all, Brian Jordan brought up changes in the lineup again. Think Fredi is listening?
“I’ve always despised a poor hitting approach. It’s selfish and short-sighted and generally stubborn. It gets hard to root for some of these guys.”
I don’t think it’s a moral or character issue. I think players’ hitting philosophies depend to at least some extent on their abilities. A guy with poor bat speed (say Jeff Francoeur) can’t be as patient a hitter because the ball will be by him. I don’t think there is anything great about Gattis’ approach. He swings as hard as he can in case he its it. (Which is pretty much what Mickey Mantle did.) The only reason people like Gattis’ approach is that, so far, it has worked. I seriously doubt that the hitters are saying, “the hell with the team, I’m going to hit the way I want.” I think it’s a lot harder than you think to simply change your hitting approach at the major league level.
96-yes, I’m just sure bj can’t change his double-bat-waffle-hitch-step-flail. It’s completely necessary. And it’s necessary for andrelton to dive in with that back shoulder and try to golf. And im sure the fact he can go 60 ab without striking out proves to you that his bat is so slow he’s stuck in his crap approach and golf swing. And there’s absolutely no way that Justin upton with his 80 power can cut down on his swing with 2 strikes and a runner on third to try to get him in. These are world class hitters. Amazing how little credit you give them.
Just read the last thread, thought I’d point out that Heyward’s offensive production tonight was well above average, even for a right fielder.
Any thoughts on if they will actually make a change to the lineup tomorrow outside of Gattis? If so, what are they?
This JohnWDB fella seems to be a bit of a troll. As with other trolls, please do not feed.
Salty, this is definitely the best Braves blog out there. Lots of great content and posters, and Alex does a great job leading the site. Just steer clear of that Sam Hutcheson guy. Bad news. (Kidding.)
Adam, why do you feel like Simba’s defense has regressed?
@101
According to every measurable defensive metric, it has…
http://www.fangraphs.com/statss.aspx?playerid=10847&position=SS#fielding
@102
I’m good with that.
@98, I will definitely agree that Heyward is a ways down on our list of problems. The WAR/defense discussions are unfortunately more interesting than our actual games.
RE: Andrelton’s defense – less chances, less chances for spectacular plays. We’re now a pretty severe fly-ball pitching team compared to the last few seasons. That said, my eyeballs think he’s been a little nonchalant on some routine plays this year, and that didn’t happen much at all last year.
I have been a die-hard Braves fan since 1958 (age 6). I’ve seen some terrible teams in the 70’s and 80’s, but this team is just very very hard to watch and even harder to like. Don’t get me wrong, I love Freddie. I think Heyward could be a good player, Gattis is a great story and I love seeing him hit, Andrelton is a marvel at short, and Tommy L. has been 400% better at second base. But watching the unbelievable stupid moves by Gonzalez, and the utter incompetence and nonchalance of BJ has got me to where, I didn’t even watch tonight’s game. (BTW—The Braves are not only de facto watching in our household, my wife and I drove 6 hrs. last week to watch the entire Rockie series—a series where it was hard not to root for Colorado, who has a line-up of hustling players, rather than the BJ Uptons of the world.)
We have to jettison Gonzalez NOW! This team is going through the motions, a change at the top is in order. Pink slip Gonzalez and Walker, bite the bullet and release Uggla, and at least bench BJ!
I think it’s time for Chris Johnson to catch some flak for being lazy.
Also it’s tough to see who, other than Ervin, would deserve to be replaced by Wood.
That’s all I got
@100
Are you serious? Troll? I don’t even know how to respond to that. I criticize the same things that John Kruk did on Sunday night. I’ve been watching the braves for 25 years. I remember the significance of Danny gladden and gene Larkin.
And if I am a troll, what of #105? What is your standard for troll? Someone who criticizes the obviously toxic aspects of the team we love? Oh, excuse me. Fredi is great cuz good for him for having the job and Bj is doing the best he can and greg walker is making lemons out of lemonade and we’re just getting unlucky and Bj should totally bat second just cuz. Cuz fredi and must know more than me cuz why why would he have that job if he weren’t good at it. And Florida fired him because they couldn’t see talent when it was right in front of them.
You sir, are the troll.
Another atrocity exhibition. Here’s to a long winning streak.
OK, any winning streak…
Every time I think (hope?) BJ is improving, he goes out of his way to prove me wrong. I remember when I first heard we signed him I did not know very much at all about him, and I thought, “Great! We got a center fielder for less than it would have cost us to resign Bourn.” About three minutes after he signed, though, I grew worried, because Rob Cope posted a long rant about how giving that type of contract to a player like BJ was a terrible move because he takes terrible routes on routine fly balls to the outfield and sometimes tries to catch the ball barehanded, and how his offensive numbers were skewed by some hot streaks, etc. He then said that we were all going to spend the next five years regretting that signing. At the time I really hoped that prediction would become the most ridiculous things ever posted on Braves Journal. Unfortunately, it is looking like one of the most accurate. Only three and a half more years…
109-Rob cope is obviously a troll. A hindsight troll. Don’t feed him.
@110, Here’s a tip: literally nobody here is a diehard Fredi supporter. The closest you’ll find are people who think managers in general don’t impact any one game enough to deserve serious scorn. Even those folks would have to concede it’s possible that Fredi could be worse than the average manager (but outside of the start of his tenure here, that doesn’t seem to be the case, as dumb as his decisions may be from game to game).
If anybody here is a foresight troll, it’s Rob. He has hated BJ from the very beginning.
@JohnWDB
Most people that have stumbled upon this site don’t leave, which means we have a lot of guys/gals that have been here for years (me personally, I’ve been here over a decade). Arguments and disagreements break out but rarely do those arguments turn to disrespect. It’s ugly in here right now, so maybe it will clean up after Gattis goes 5-5 with 5 homeruns today. My advice would be to not assume that anyone in here are unintelligent drones that you might have encountered elsewhere. Not being rude, merely trying to help.
On lineup construction…just get B.J. out of the 2-hole and everything will work itself out. Having 2 guys in your top 4 that are 2nd and 4th in the NL in strikeouts is rally suicide.
Rob was right.
I’ve been known to get my troll on.
Completely agreed with Ryan. I get that it’s great to get BJ going, but it’s not going to happen, and in the interim, we need to score runs. Getting him out of the #2 hole has to be the answer at this point.
There are so many under-performers on the offensive side that it’s hard to get a feel for who is going to rebound and who is who they are. I’m confident CJ, Simmons’ and Heyward’s production will improve by the end of the year, we’ll find our 7th inning reliever and a LOOGY, and we’ll be rocking and rolling. Gosh, it’s just frustrating in the meantime.
The Braves’ current problems are directly linked to many of this site’s denizens’ propensity to wear orange. If all you Gator/Vol/War Eagle fans would convert to the true Red and Black religion, then the Braves would be unbeatable.
Hope this doesn’t cross the line, Alex.
Because I’m too lazy to look I am guessing that we are getting below league average offense out of SS, 3B, CF and RF.
Giving BJ 5 PAs per game is just plain dumbass. Putting BJ 8th may help him. He seems to be willing to take a walk this year so ….. Dang on second thought maybe they’ll pitch to him to avoid the throwing to the pitcher.
I get to post all of Smitty’s barber rumors over at Tomahawk Take! The Braves and Red Sox could have a match!
http://tomahawktake.com/2014/06/18/bravesred-sox-trade-look-like/
JohnWDB,
I was simply responding to your implication that the hitters’ poor hitting approaches were a moral failing as opposed to a physical problem. Just because they are world class athletes doesn’t mean they can do whatever they want whenever they want to. The pitchers are world-class too and they are trying to get them out. It’s just not as easy as you want to believe but it’s more satisfying, apparently, for you to think they aren’t trying because they are a bunch of selfish assholes. Sorry, I don’t buy that. Do they have problematic approaches? Obviously. I just don’t think it reflects on their character like you do. Fans who don’t even know these guys seem to think that they can understand their character simply from how they perform on the field. So Barry Bonds is a great guy because he was a great hitter.
This site is amazing, have been looking for good pitch f/x data by hitter as I’ve been curious how umps have called BJ’s at bats. The bottom chart is the most relevant here, as it shows maybe 6 pitches all year that should have been balls called strikes and many more pitches that should have been strikes called balls.
I’m with Ryan @14 #shutitbj
http://pitchfx.texasleaguers.com/batter/425834/?pitchers=A&count=AA&pitches=AA&from=3%2F28%2F2014&to=6%2F17%2F2014
@119, I’ll give BJ a pass to the extent that I think a lot of his behavior stems from his frustration. I’m sure he is embarrassed by how he has played so he naturally looks to find someone else to blame. Obviously, it’s not helping his performance and is certainly not going help his reputation with umpires.
I miss Jason Schiell’s wife. I think it’s actually pretty cool that she came on here and blasted us. Looking at his career, he was a guy with a lot of talent who just couldn’t stay healthy. After his 4 games with Atlanta (3 starts) and his 8+ ERA, he was out of baseball. That’s sad times.
I wish we could get the Upton mother on here. She’s been on ESPN 3 times that I know of in the last year. Ryan, you’re Mr. Exclusive. Make it happen.
Boom! Lineup:
La Stella 4 Pena 6 Freeman 3 Gattis 2 Heyward 9 Johnson 5 Doumit 7 Schafer 8 Harang 1
@122
Truthfully, that’s where La Stella belongs until he stops getting on base. If it were up to me, the top of the order would go La Stella, Heyward, Gattis, Freeman, Jupton.
Whoa… not starting anything political here, but the Washington Redskins have lost the patent on their name as the Patent office labeled it “disparaging”. I could see the Braves having to change their logo, but their name is probably safe.
@115
I guess the Braves will have to suck.
@124
That is big news.
I would go:
LaStella, Justin, Freeman, Gattis, Heyward, Johnson, BJ and Simmons.
I would go:
La Stella, Simmons, Freeman, J. Upton, Gattis, Heyward, B.J. Upton, Johnson, Pitcher
I think it is a better distribution top to bottom.
Has anybody seen the official line up for today or are we going on speculation?
Lineup is accurate and DOB reports that La Stella is there to stay for awhile. Good news! Interested to see full lineup on Friday.
@ 129
So, J. Upton and Simmons have the day off, but are we about to start seeing a platoon situation in CF?
I think Simmons will occupy the 2-hole come Friday and J. Upton goes 4 or 5 pushing Heyward back to 6-hole where he has hit well in his career. I could see that order providing some production with Shaefer and B.J. swapping time in CF and hitting 8th.
I guess we will have to wait and see. I will say this. I do hope we are not putting La Stella in a prime spot to early thus pressuring him. Although he has showed a coolness that I am not used to seeing in rookies so far this season.
Schafer is worse than BJ.
@131
That is like comparing one rotten apple to the next. You still have two rotten apples.
@131 – Totally agreed. BJ sucks but Schafer shouldn’t be in the majors. Pena is not a good hitter and he’s going to be getting the second most ABs of anyone in the lineup. Doumit’s not an especially good hitter at this point either, and he’s the worst defender in LF any of us might ever see. Maybe this lineup works out for a day or two but it has major ugliness potential. Guess it can’t be worse than the last couple of performances, but…yuck.
I am surprised we haven’t brought Pastornicky up to see what his outfield potential would be. I remember they were working him in the outfield some last year in Triple A.
Continuing the theme, Pastornicky is worse than Schafer. Honestly, there is no problem that’s solvable within the current organization.
@133
This lineup is not a set past today. We all know Simmons and J. Upton will be back in their Friday. The only true question is there something brewing for CF?
I think come Friday the lineup will be more along the lines of:
La Stella, Simmons, Freeman, Gattis, J. Upton, Heyward, Johnson, CF, Pitcher
Gattis and J. Upton might swap spots, but I bet that is kind of what it looks like. Anybody have any suggestions at a CF bandage. Remember, we are tapped out in salary cap for what the Braves spend and all this wishful thinking of unloading our big contracts in Uggla and B.J. is getting sad. I think Pastornicky could be fun to watch in LF, slide J. Upton to RF, and Heyward to CF. They have toyed with Pastornicky in the outfield in Triple A some.
@135
Pastornicky is no where near worse than Schafer at the plate. I will say it would be a drop in the field though.
@135
I am not saying Pastornicky is a good replacement either. What I am basically saying is that the two options we have at the majors right now is not working. Why not try something else for maybe a 5 game stretch just to see what happens? If not, we try something else. It sure beats the alternative of just continuing with what we have been doing.
@137
True, but Pastor’s “superior” offense still has not met an acceptable minimum standard for a major leaguer, leaving him utterly without a usable skill. Schafer’s speed at least gives him some marginal roster utility. He can bunt, pinch run, and run down a few balls in the outfield. He’d have a longer career if he’d come around 40 years ago, but he’s still not completely useless.
I understand Willie Mays is not doing anything. He’s 83 but can he be worse than BJ?
@139
I agree that Schafer’s speed makes him a viable bench player, but we are talking about needing someone who can come in and possibly give us more than B.J. and Schafer. Both B.J. and Schafer hit left handers horribly, and out of the two, B.J. actually hits right handers better than Schafer. So, where does that leave us with a platoon? Doumit is way too much of a liability to be in the outfield more than once or twice every 15 games or so.
The point being, something has to be attempted. We cannot get anybody from the outside because there is no one we can afford. I know some people have mentioned Sizemore after his release. There is a reason he was released. He does not have the speed or power anymore and is barely hitting any better than B.J. average wise. We have to solve this from within the organization which does not look pretty.
Say hey!
Pastornicky can’t play CF. The best thing we could do if find a platoon partner for BJ that can play center and kills RH pitching.
@143
I am not suggestion Pastornicky play CF. I am suggesting we move Heyward to CF where he has played tremendously in the past, J. Upton to RF, and find a LF that can provide us even the slightest amount more of production in LF. Thus, the suggestion of Pastornicky who has worked in LF.
There is, also, Todd Cunningham who is a true LF down in Triple AAA. He is a switch hitter who has solid numbers this year with some speed on the basepaths.
So, will there be a new game thread up for the game about to start?
FYI there is a game on Thursday (re references to the Friday lineup) we start a 4-game set in Washington.
@145 Trying to get one to post.
Game thread up.
@salty
I think your lineup with Simmons at 2nd is wishful thinking. He will not be there. He’s in the midst of a 2 month .591 OPS slump and is leading the team in GIDP. That doesn’t sound like a number 2 hitter.
118-
When everyone including Chipper (who graciously volunteered his time) tells BJ the same thing (he wraps his bat making his swing late and looped) and he refuses to respond, then yes, I think it can only be stubbornness and pride. What does he have to lose by keeping a still bat and just seeing how it goes?
You are right that I cannot reliably draw conclusions about character from performance, but the two are not totally unrelated and I think my conclusion about BJ is reasonable. I allow that it could be wrong. Your Barry bonds argument is a strawman. Of course I don’t think performing well means you have a good character. But I do think it’s reasonable that refusing to listen to advice and trying to gold homers regardless of circumstance are indicative of a self-centered approach. Also it’s not as if bj hasn’t been perceived as selfish and haughty wherever he’s been for a variety of other reasons. I might ask you what evidence you have that BJ is not stubborn, prideful, and selfish.
@150,
This is what you originally said and what I responded to:
“I’ve always despised a poor hitting approach. It’s selfish and short-sighted and generally stubborn. It gets hard to root for some of these guys.”
That’s a broad statement. You didn’t limit it to BJ Upton. IMO, a poor hitting approach is an approach that doesn’t work. By some lights, Vladimir Guerrero had a poor hitting approach, Yogi Berra (known for hitting bad pitches) might have had a poor hitting approach. But what they did worked. But they might have been just as selfish themselves. The point is, you don’t know.
If you want to make an argument that particular players, ie., BJ Upton, refuse to respond to advice and have selfish tendencies, that’s one thing. It’s another thing to say a a poor hitting approach is, ipso facto, indicative of someone being “selfish and stubborn.” Maybe it’s just harder to change than you think. Maybe some of these guys just aren’t as good as you think.
You are correct–my statement was a gross generalization. I just happen to think it’s correct in many cases. I think uggla has an outstanding character, but I also think he’s incredibly stubborn for not blowing his swing up. The 2b plays to the left of 2b and he still refuses to hit it to right. Maybe it’s not appropriate to call it selfish. Maybe it’s more accurately “the psychology of previous investment”
P.S. an approach isn’t bad if it works. What works is best for the team and usually the player too.
@ 152 I don’t see why you believe Uggla’s character is so exceptional in relation to those of other players. I recall that he moped around and criticized management for keeping him off the playoff roster last year, something I don’t regard as exactly Dale Murphy-like conduct.